Video: KTVU Protesting in San Francisco : Propaganda at it’s finest

I recently came across this video on zomblog. However, the thing that disturbs me the most is that this guy has NO idea what he is talking about.

As you watch the video, he proceeds to tell you that the Palestine protesters reached over the blockade to attack a pro-Israel. Although it may seem like the case, the camera shot was quickly cut and jumped ahead. For all we know these pro-isreal protesters we’re saying some nasty shit.

I’m not trying to pick a side, but I do get rather frustrated when I see someone like this take a video and turn it into a joke. You CANNOT comment on who started what from this video. Yeah the guy was spooked, look at him! He’s scared because he is protesting something that he has no idea what he is talking about. These individuals have been brainwashed by the US Government. How many protestors do you see, hiding behind a sign saying “im spooked”. Confidence people. come on!

It just seems really weird to me that there are like 5 pro-isreal protesters, and hundreds of Palestine protesters. It’s almost like this zomblog is promoting some major propaganda.  He concludes with “It’s as if the battle in Gaza has come to San Francisco.” GIVE ME A BREAK! Someone tell this guy to go shove it.

For some reason, I see this whole war playing out as a benefit to Obama as they try to brainwash us some more.

212 Responses

  1. 1sanddog on Jan 3, 2009 at 5:25 pm:

    At the point the protest turns violent, the police need to shut them down. Move the counter protesters to safety and then order the pro-pals to disperse. If they don’t do it willingly, so much the better.

  2. 2Anonymous on Jan 3, 2009 at 5:30 pm:

    Thank you Zombie for your invaluable documention of acts and events that the loathsome MSM ignores or excuses.

  3. 3Zimriel on Jan 3, 2009 at 5:40 pm:

    Nitpick: it’s more likely “kilâbna” than “qalabna” which as far as I know doesn’t exist. (”Qulûbna” would mean “our hearts”.)

    Khaybar refers to the Jews of the oasis of that name. First Muhammad defeated and subjugated them, and then the caliph ‘Umar ran them off.

  4. 4chris on Jan 3, 2009 at 6:12 pm:

    “Falastin balad’na” translates more literally to “palestine is our country.”

  5. 5ren on Jan 3, 2009 at 6:32 pm:

    They should be beaten severely with the batons in rhyme to their chants of “free free palestine”

  6. 6Barbara on Jan 3, 2009 at 6:33 pm:

    Saw the video. You could tell it was egged on by that female. As soon as they had the TV recording they took every advantage. We need to boot them out of this country and send them back home were they belong. there mission is to start destruction in this country. Tell me people are you going to allow it.??????? This is not their country. You can bet your bottom dollar if it starts over there in Israel they are going to bring it to our shores. Do you want Marshall Law. ??? Do you want to give Bush a reason. Then stop them at all cost. !!!!!!! THINK PEOPLE !!!!!! LOOK BEYOND YOUR NOSES. THINK OF THE POSSIBLITIES THEY WILL TRY TO DISRUPT US.!!!!!

  7. 7DaMav on Jan 3, 2009 at 6:34 pm:

    San Franciscans marching in support of Hamas are like chickens marching in support of Colonel Sanders.

  8. 8Anonymous on Jan 3, 2009 at 6:54 pm:

    The street was filled with missed opportunities.

  9. 9Desert Rat on Jan 3, 2009 at 6:59 pm:

    Arabs and Muslims supported Hitler in World War II and they’re still Nazis to this day.

  10. 10Mambo Bananapatch on Jan 3, 2009 at 7:13 pm:

    The tiny group of pro-Israeli demonstrators should have thrown stuff at the much stronger group of Palestinians, and when the latter retaliated, accused them of reacting disproportionately.

  11. 11bob on Jan 3, 2009 at 7:56 pm:

    a counter cry that pro-Isarel demonstrators can say in Arabic:

    Israil baladana, w’al-Arab kalabana

    Khaybar Khaybar ya’Muhammed jaish Israil sa’ya’ud

  12. 12Anonymous on Jan 3, 2009 at 7:57 pm:

    you people are disgusting!!!

  13. 13Anonymous on Jan 3, 2009 at 7:59 pm:

    israel has been practicing ethnic cleansing for over three decades then blaming the victims of their violence

  14. 14Marshall Schwartz on Jan 3, 2009 at 8:01 pm:

    Friday evening’s miserable performance by the SFPD was at least the third time that I can recall such a botched job — Tuesday evening being the second. They made no effort to stop the jihadis from breaking thru the police barricades, and refused to do anything (e.g., arrest) those who did. I have no problem with the officers on the street — they have done the best they can under the situation and orders they face, especially in evacuating safely the five San Francisco Voice for Israel counterprotestors on Friday evening. But the senior officers of the SFPD are at best hopeless, and at worst doing their best to favor the anti-Israel crazies (well, not all of them, but a very large number of them). We need to file a formal complaint with the SFPD. I might suggest something about the general attitude of the senior officers of the SFPD, but that’s just an opinion, not something I can support by facts — so I’ll just leave it there.

  15. 15ECM on Jan 3, 2009 at 8:08 pm:

    “israel has been practicing ethnic cleansing for over three decades then blaming the victims of their violence.”

    If it’s taken Israel over three decades to ethnically cleanse such a small population, their hearts cleary aren’t in it which is kind of like how your head isn’t particularly into thinking.

  16. 16Alex on Jan 3, 2009 at 8:11 pm:

    If I didn’t mind getting arrested so much, that video would inspire me to head down there tomorrow with a backpack full of old shoes.

  17. 17Anonymous on Jan 3, 2009 at 8:14 pm:

    Why is it that nobody in the anti-Jewish group is being charged with a hate crime?

  18. 18Muhamad Bendover on Jan 3, 2009 at 8:26 pm:

    Let’s blame the Jews! Or maybe Bush! Isn’t Bush a Jew? Why are the Jews destroying the magnificant Palestinian culture? Look how we have maintained our cities and towns, raised our children and educated our people.

  19. 19Kevin on Jan 3, 2009 at 8:48 pm:

    Our country was built upon many freedoms that are allowed to be expressed. It is a shame that these freedoms which were purchased with so much blood of our forefathers is being abused. Difference of opinions is an American curse/blessing. Folks who take this freedom to peddle hate and discontent in the name of religion is deplorable. Ethnic cleansing? What about every cease fire that has been “agreed” to by the Hamas and those countries surrounding Isreal. Look back to see how many times these were violated by either using the time to amass large troop buildups or just plain ignoring the cease fire leaving Isreal as the only one honoring the agreement. How about the Gaza strip. Palestine complains for a token from Isreal and uses it as a jump off point for future attacks. If Isreal was just left alone, I can imagine peace. How long does this go on? To quote a very couragous woman…”when our enemies love thier children more than they hate us”. It is a small country that is really not worth the great and extended efforts of hate expelled upon it. What does it really take to make an individual happy. I cannot see myself saying “the death of those who do not believe as I do”. But if someone was to break into my house and threaten my loved ones, do not believe for a moment that I would stand by and just say “excuse me while we die”.

  20. 20Daniel on Jan 3, 2009 at 8:49 pm:

    You really have to question whether a “Free Palestine” would be any more “free” than any other Islamic state.

    Would it be “Free” for women? Or would they be oppressed in home and in public.

    Would it be “Free” for homosexuals? Or would they be executed.

    Would it be “Free” for non-Muslims? Or would they second-class citizens, required to pay ‘Jizya’

    Would it be “Free” for minorities of non-montheistic religions? Or would they be executed.

    I think we all know the answer, and yet these brainwashed so-called human-rights activists still equate a “Free Palestine” with their own freedom. Fools.

  21. 21nadadhimmi on Jan 3, 2009 at 8:51 pm:


  22. 22Anonymous on Jan 3, 2009 at 8:51 pm:

    Scorpions in a bottle. A plague on both their houses.

  23. 23Craig on Jan 3, 2009 at 9:12 pm:

    The reason these “palestinian” morons stage their violent protests in San Francisco is because they know the cops won’t stop them. The inmates have been running the asylum there for a long, long time. I knew an SF cop who quit the force after being on the vice squad there. It was so corrupt that he was told by higher ups where he could raid and where he couldn’t.

    That was in about 1975. Imagine what it’s like now. Pity the street cops. Loathe their bosses.

  24. 24Anonymous on Jan 3, 2009 at 9:23 pm:

    here’s a big FUCK YOU to all the ZIONIST SCUM who think that dropping US BOMBS out of US WARPLANES and KILLING INNOCENTS– mothers, babies, and non-violent GAZA SUFFERERS is a good thing. what if the tables were turned and the ISRAELI COWARDS only had non-guided, big bottle-rockets to fire at their OPPRESSORS?? what then? would JEWS world wide be TERRORISTS for FIGHTING FOR THEIR HUMAN RIGHTS?

  25. 25average_guy on Jan 3, 2009 at 9:43 pm:

    #24 Anonymous:

    Thanks for making such a well reasoned and articulate statement. Now go take your medication.

  26. 26Steve on Jan 3, 2009 at 9:52 pm:

    Wouldn’t it be sweet if we could send these scumbags to Gaza to join their brethren in the struggle.?

  27. 27I could tell you, but then I’d have to kill you. on Jan 3, 2009 at 9:55 pm:

    IAF is getting secondaries on bombing runs worthy of munitions dumps. One at a Mosque! If you’re so concerned about innocents, what about those ducking unguided (read random victims) Palestinian rockets fired into Israel? They are more than “bottle rockets”. Very selective sympathies you have there, and starting off with a big “fuck you” doesn’t encourage consideration of your commentary. It just makes you sound like a foot-stamping child demanding its way. Like many of those protesters, reaching out to whack those who do not agree with them. Death to all who disagree with us!

  28. 28Eddy on Jan 3, 2009 at 10:00 pm:

    #24 Anonymus:

    It is so convenient how you distort the reality and leave out the facts. If the morons in Gaza had not elected a terrorist group backed by Iran and Syria to represent them, they might find life much better. Progress was being made until then and that is when increased rocket attacks on innocent mothers, babies, and non-violent civilians increased significantly. I should stop here because reasoning with you is like reasoning with Hamas, it will never happen. They, like you, are incapable of reason and would rather die and kill mothers, babies, and non-violent civilians in the most cowardly acts imaginable, through suicide bombings. So, exactly what human rights are they fighting for?

  29. 29DrZero on Jan 3, 2009 at 10:14 pm:

    Dear Barbara,

    While these people are obviously low life libtard scum, I seriously doubt most of them are Palestinian, or even Arab or even Muslim. They are simply the lefty trash that floats around San Francisco bay. I am no more scared or concerned about them than about Barney the Purple Dinosaur.

    BTW: It is “martial law” not “marshall law”.

  30. 30Aaron’s cc: on Jan 3, 2009 at 10:22 pm:

    Buy Spam by the gallon and throw it. Or simply wear inexpensive pigskin working gloves. There’s a market for aerosol pork, I think.

    Until the majority of Muslim imams renounce the tenet that the only future for non-Muslims are limited to conversion, death, or dhimmitude, they have no right to live in a free society. We cannot trust them until then.

  31. 31Rob Spectre on Jan 3, 2009 at 10:30 pm:

    I was on the other side of the scuffle from the camera when this broke out. The heated shouting makes it seem more violent than it really was.

    The 7 or 8 guys who came to support Israel showed up right as the pro-Palestinian demonstration was winding down. They weren’t at the march’s start at Powell and Market nor during the hour long demonstration in front of the Israeli Consulate. By the time they arrived, the pro-Palestinian crowd had diminished by half.

    The Israeli supporter in the trenchcoat defied the directions the police gave the counter-protesters and went directly over to the barricade in a gap between two officers who weren’t paying attention. He wasn’t suppose to pass the police line and get directly next to the pro-Palestinian crowd. From where I was standing, it seemed deliberately provocative.

    I didn’t hear what he said to the guy who pushed him, but the pusher claims it was vulgar.

    Regardless, police pulled the pro-Israeli guy back to where he should have been in the first place and (to their rare credit) the organizers from Answer neutralized expertly the threat of anything more serious happening.

    Five miles of marching and three and a half hours of peaceful demonstration and this ten seconds is the only exchange remotely close to confrontational.

    As convenient as something more sensational would be, it just didn’t happen.

  32. 32Bill Grant on Jan 3, 2009 at 10:54 pm:

    You know, unless we all start getting really mad and really loud and start pushing back against this shit this country is doomed. Obama, Pelosi, Reid, Huffington and these pieces of shit are not going to leave a whole lot that would be recognizable as the USA. I am pretty sick seeing this country hijacked by scumbags like this and getting pissed off and complaining to no one in particular on the internet doesn’t seem to be doing a whole lot to roll back the wave of crap that these creeps represent so well.

    This needs to be fought… and we are just complaining.

  33. 33Mo on Jan 3, 2009 at 10:59 pm:


    If a terrorist group was firing rockets and GRAD rockets (which are similiar to V2’s) into Los Angeles would you want the US Marines to go across the Mexican border and bomb the crap out of their “mosques” (which they just hide spare explosives in)?

    Don’t you think in this hypothetical situation that the Mexican government and PEOPLE that elected a terrorist leader should be held responsible? Or do you think we should just let them continue to bombard us with mortars and rockets and say, “eh, we can’t counter them they are just fighting for their freedom”?

    BS dude. Israel GAVE them the Gaza Strip. When these morons tried to escape to Egypt, Egypt placed border guards ARMED to keep them out. Egypt doesn’t want terrorist sympathizers. They tried fighting Israel and lost. They are one of the smarter Muslim countries.

    What do you libtards seriously expect Israel to do? To just roll over and let the violent muslims destroy them? That’s what they want. They don’t give a Rat’s ass about freedom. They want to be ruled by a caliphate.

    And to the idiot Who said that “Israel is commiting genocide”

    If Israel through the IDF was comitting genocide why would they try to save the lives of these idiot terrorists who were still in their tunnel when the rockets exploded?

    Why did they do the same thing for the lebanese?

    You morons need to grow a brain and then get a clue. Maybe then you want just espouse the same idiotic leftard talking points.

  34. 34Hard Right on Jan 3, 2009 at 10:59 pm:

    Rob, I’m reeeeal sure that’s what happened. It’s those dirty Jew’s fault. Come on, say it. You know you want to ya jackass.

  35. 35Hard Right on Jan 3, 2009 at 11:15 pm:

    Well lo and behold, lookie what I found. I did a little search on rob and guess what? He is the terrorist loving douche he come across as. Here’s a little quote from his site:

    “Today we’re live blogging on FriendFeed from this afternoon’s demonstration against the continued Israeli massacre in Gaza. With the war crime extending into a seventh day…”

    Rob, GFY. I hope Israel kills 300 more hamas members on a daily basis.

  36. 36AOP on Jan 3, 2009 at 11:19 pm:

    Hard Right:

    Nice citizen journalism. There was something fishy about that post of Rob’s.


  37. 37GoGators on Jan 3, 2009 at 11:20 pm:

    When Israel was attacked in the 60s and 70s, they should have allowed Egypt and Syria to occupy small swaths of land, rather than vice-versa. Then they could have done whatever they wanted to the civilian populations of those countries over the past decades–hurl rockets, launch suicide attacks–and claim they were merely opposing “occupation.” But, of course, such moronic liberal logic wouldn’t apply in that situation, because if the Left didn’t have double standards, they’d have no standards at all.

  38. 38Rob Spectre on Jan 3, 2009 at 11:23 pm:

    @Hard Right

    I was there.

    No one else on this thread was, post author included.

    I’m not saying the Palestinian supporter didn’t shove, but suggesting that the guy in the trenchcoat was blameless is inaccurate.

    One shove quickly resolved is a shite sight away from the histrionics levied by this thread.

  39. 39Rob Spectre on Jan 3, 2009 at 11:26 pm:

    RE: My post.

    Full disclosure – I covered the event for my blog and have been photographed doing such by zombietime before.

    The whole of the post can be found here:

    I don’t think clicking on my name on my comment qualifies as “citizen journalism.”

  40. 40Anonymous on Jan 3, 2009 at 11:35 pm:

    Childishly naive at this point to think that the Israeli/Arab conflict wouldn’t manifest itself here, when this country’s actions are integral to what happens there.

  41. 41Mike on Jan 4, 2009 at 12:40 am:

    Some of these pro-pal / nazis could be connected directly to Hamas or Iran. I hope the CIA is checking out the faces…

  42. 42Jack on Jan 4, 2009 at 12:53 am:

    Muslims do not create, they destroy.

    Muslims do not love, they hate.

    Muslims do not have joy, only twisted honor. (I slap you with the soles of my feet, you sick Muslim shites.)

    Muslims are not tolerant of others, they are in fact racists.

    Muslims do not produce anything.

    If Islam disappeared tomorrow, the world would lose nothing.

  43. 43Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 1:09 am:

    islam is religious terrorism and muslims are

    religous terrorists read quran

  44. 44Evil Monk on Jan 4, 2009 at 1:10 am:

    To all the anonymous posters and other such supporters of Hamas:

    How exactly do you call it a genocide, ethnic cleansing, or rampant murder when the percentage of terrorists being killed in these attacks by Israel is 94%, and the civilian death toll is only 6%.

    …or that the Israeli Air Force drops leaflets telling the civilians to leave an area.

    …or that the IAF makes mass cellphone calls to buildings about to be struck, waits for the Hamas to inevitably send all the women and children to the roof, fires what amounts to a “flash-bang” missile (perfectly harmless but loud and bright as hell) at the building to clear it off and out, then proceeds to level it once all the innocents are gone.

    These are obviously the actions of deranged lunatics bent only on the deaths of numerous innocents.

    I understand that you will attempt to refute such facts by means of your own sources of information, but then how do you explain Egypt’s, Jordan’s, and even Saudi Arabia’s condemnation of Hamas’ actions over the last few weeks?

    I understand that in this day and age, an unfortunate side-effect of our modern culture is that facts are flexible, but even with all the elasticity you could force into these events and their perceived forms of reality, you are holding the line on a position that is tenuous at best.

    So please, let the bumper-sticker slogans, irrational hatred, and ignorance of facts go, and accept that the Israelis are defending themselves, Hamas is evil, and that sometimes, yes, violence is the answer.

  45. 45Aaron’s cc: on Jan 4, 2009 at 1:13 am:

    Those who love death, hate God. Go read Proverbs 8.

    That any religious American could find any common ground with adherents to a faith that openly professes loving death is siding with those who hate God.

    Which side are you on? Can you face your Maker trying to defend not fighting those who hate Him?

  46. 46Aaron’s cc: on Jan 4, 2009 at 1:19 am:

    Will Obama flip after he is sworn in?

    President-elect Barack Obama has voiced sympathy for Israel’s predicament. During his visit to Israel last summer, he held a news conference in Sderot, the southern town that has borne the brunt of the Gaza rocket attacks, saying he does not “think any country would find it acceptable to have missiles raining down on the heads of their citizens.”

    “If somebody was sending rockets into my house where my two daughters sleep at night, I’m going to do everything in my power to stop that,” Obama said at the time. “And I would expect Israelis to do the same thing.”

  47. 47Carpet Burn on Jan 4, 2009 at 2:09 am:

    Hey, anybody know if there’s some hot Pally beefcakes down at the protest? This ‘Jewish’ boy is circumsized and all eager to do some serious diplomatic, knee grinding work. Palestine? It will be more like Pumpestine! You can tell them protestors ain’t had it in a while – they’re so angry (yet so gaye)! Lucky I’m the sort of lad to do it, mmmmmm. Hands off Palestine – and put them on a hot Palestinian instead!

  48. 48Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 2:13 am:

    Dutch parliament member Harry van Bommel (Socialist Party) calls for intifada against Israel during anti-Israel / pro Gaza, pro Hamas, pro Hezbollah demonstration in Amsterdam.

    January 3rd, 2008

  49. 49wildcolonialboy71 on Jan 4, 2009 at 2:22 am:

    for fucks sake, lets face facts here….somebody, and we wont mention names, for fear of persecution (i dont want to get popped off by some mossad agent one dark stormy night while dreaming how the hell am i gonna get kate winslet to bed) stole somebody else’s land! i mean in all seriousness, if somebody came over to your house and claimed it was his what really would you do? apart from going apeshit….? its easy to sympathise with the pallies…. and now the chosen one and choosing to be the intolerant aggressors….for those that defend, israel may think that palestine is legally theres, but its the opposite with the pallies…if they are lobbying a few firecrackers into israel then shit…see the frustration from them as it is…a displaced people, an oppressed one at that. unfortunately…there will never be peace in the middle east with an aggressive israel, or just israel even….

    give back the land dear chosen ones, and do not forget your real homeland in siberia somewhere…

  50. 50Earthling on Jan 4, 2009 at 2:31 am:

    wildcolonialboy71, you have no understanding of history what-so-ever, do you? You come of as a damned fool.

  51. 51Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 3:36 am:

    Here’s more video images of the demonstration in which that Dutch parliament member shouted intifada. Gives you an idea of his fellow protesters who openly support terrorist organisations: “Hamas, Jihad, Hezbollah”

    Around a minute, you’ll hear in the background: “Hamas, hamas, joden aan het gas”, which means:

    “Hamas, hamas, Jews to the gas”

  52. 52masitre on Jan 4, 2009 at 5:25 am:

    The fighting the we see today is the direct reslt of the end to WWII. When the war ended the leaders of Great Britain and the United States did not want to be flooded with thousands of Jewish refugees. THeir problem was what to do with these people! The great idea was to dump them back in their homelad?? Problem, there were people who had been living ther for thosands of years, but hey these are just poor dirt farmers and the Jews would improve their lives. So you dump several thousand people on to lland owned by someone else, then when they get upset you send in troops “the first war 1949″ and move the christain arabs off the lland that generations had lived and died on, you make them leave their ancestars behind and you do not pay them, you just tear down their homes and build new Jewish homes. Now if you wereone of these families forced to move would you not be upset? So give their land back.

  53. 53Webster on Jan 4, 2009 at 5:28 am:

    @41: This protest was inside the United States, and thus outside CIA’s jurisdiction. I imagine the FBI was looking at it, though.

  54. 54Tom Cat on Jan 4, 2009 at 5:30 am:

    This is shocking, the pro-isrealy media tht is!!! much of isreal’s woe’s today were created by isreal itself and now to further their mistakes, they are fighting and killing innocents. US shouldn’t support such shameless atrocities and should take immidiate action against them. u say u r spooked by those harmless protesters, think of all those unarmed civilians, women and children in Gaza who have been suffer for isreal’s cruelty!!! don’t do on to others sumthng u wouldn’t want others do on to u or ur luved ones!!

  55. 55Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 5:47 am:

    Israel has been conducting a slow motion holocaust for 100 years on the Palestinian people. Within the last 24 hrs Israel has killed dozens of women and children. It is Israel that is the aggressor and always has been. America needs to stop support for this Apartheid state, this racist regime this terrorist state. However, America can’t because America is under the Zionist yoke as much as the Palestinians are. Washington DC is Israeli occupied area. The USA gives them 3 billion a year and they turn around and use that money to bribe our politicians. There is no US politician who is anti-Israel; isn’t that curious? Israel from the very beginning was a bad idea. Israel from the very beginning has been a gigantic flim flam on America. ALL US taxpayers are being robed by these people who use the weapons we give them to kill women and children. What needs to happen to Israel is what happened to S.Africa. With any luck Israeli children will be riding the school bus with Palestinian school children next generation.

  56. 56Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 5:57 am:

    Who cares if the Dutch President is calling for an Intifada. Israel is a terrorist state. Always was. It’s a basic human right to resist oppression. I hope a lot of Israelis come home in body bags from this offensive. We can only hope. My sympathies are entirely with the Palestinians. 100 years of suffering Israeli racist cruelty is enough. I can’t believe America supports a terrorist state. Israel has proved to be the greatest calamity for America and the world. Israel proves the chief weakness of America: the ability of a small well organized and well funded lobby to DICTATE policy

  57. 57Fight Ignorance on Jan 4, 2009 at 5:58 am:

    Please, do not hate Muslims as a whole because some among them have done wrong. Generalizations of this nature are never true, because all people are different. Everyone has different motives, thoughts, beliefs. Reacting with vitriol and animosity only foments violence and furthers ignorance. In spreading hatred, you become your enemy.

  58. 58Rob on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:02 am:

    How lovely we have haters in the USA screaming and jumping like monkeys on the public streets, abusing the freedom of expression to peddle and promote violence, hate and genocide toward a group of people.


  59. 59Tex on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:11 am:

    Funny how Allah never lets Muslims win. Ever.

    Maybe He’s not on their side?

    On account of they’re disgusting haters and behave like animals. Just like their supporters.

    I’m with Israel, 100%

  60. 60Adam Rinkleff on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:16 am:

    Israel does not represent the Jewish people. The Israeli nation was stolen from the people of Palestine. The nation of Israel is guilty of war-crimes. If the Israelis want peace, they are going to have to admit those three critical facts.

  61. 61Adam Rinkleff on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:18 am:

    And the comments here make it very clear that the pro-Palestinian crowd is racist. Go ahead and call Palestinians monkeys, and talk about how Islam has never created anything of merit, and talk about how you wish the cops would beat the pro-Palestinian supporters… yes, go ahead and make it blatantly obvious that you are a racist bigot.

  62. 62Adam Rinkleff on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:19 am:

    And the comments here make it very clear that the pro-Israeli crowd is racist. Go ahead and call Palestinians monkeys, and talk about how Islam has never created anything of merit, and talk about how you wish the cops would beat the pro-Palestinian supporters… yes, go ahead and make it blatantly obvious that you are a racist bigot.

  63. 63Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:22 am:


  64. 64K Ackermann on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:31 am:

    Reading what I am here, I never realized there were so many hate-filled Jewish bigots.

    I think maybe you lost that battle for God to come and walk among you.

  65. 65B. on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:39 am:

    I find it funny that there are so many anonymous posts… cowards!!! As far as I’m concerned, since the Jews built Jerusalem thousands of years ago, that tells me that they are entitled to live there as well. To Israelis enduring muslim aggression: fight the good fight! And just to make sure all pro-palestinian scum know where I stand… I am a bigot, I HATE MUSLIMS… my hatred will die when muslims start to teach their children to LIVE for the sake of allah instead of DYING for the sake of allah… how anyone can watch video of kids no older than my own kid shout hate-filled rambllings and not understand that the muslim religion is really a cult of death inspired by nazi ideals is beyond me.

    B. Perez

  66. 66Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:42 am:

    “How lovely we have haters in the USA screaming and jumping like monkeys on the public streets, abusing the freedom of expression to peddle and promote violence, hate and genocide toward a group of people.



    The only people on this board who seem to be promoting vilolence appear to be native born. Most of them are promoting hatred and violence against all muslims.

    This isn’t a religious issue, never has been.

    The problem didn’t begin after WWII, it began during WWI. The Brits (aka evil empire, think about it) worked to persuade various Arab tribal leaders to fight with them to overthrow the Ottoman empire. The tribes worked together to help the Brits and when it was all over…no freedom, just a new empire – the British one.

    Brits turned a blind eye to large numbers of Jews to entering the area known as Palestine.

    So you have an illegal immigration, with the immigrants bringing cash to an impoverished population. Immigrants eventually have enough of a foothold and enough military backing to take over the country and begin to subjegate the people already there.

    Isreal declared itself a nation in 1948, and promtly violate what it claimed were its borders in 1949.

    They used the same lame-ass excuse Americans have for stealing someone’s land…”they weren’t doing much with it”

    This isn’t the muslim version, or terrorist version…just read Isreali history, on a Jewish site, and you will see the facts are the same.

    The big question is who is playing whom? Isreal or the US? We know who is footing the bill – the American taxpayer.

    I am sick of it. Stop supplying Isreal with money and weapons and let them sort this out themselves.

  67. 67Ian on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:43 am:

    #52, masitre, you have ABSOLUTELY no idea what you’re talking about. There has been a Jewish presence in Israel for thousands of years. In the mid-1800s when the Ottoman Turks controlled the area, the only people who lived there were Jews and Bedouins, THERE WAS NO SUCH THINGS AS A PALESTINIAN. The Zionists started coming in the late 1800s, the land started flourishing, and that’s when the Egyptians, Syrians, and various other Arabs stared coming in. After WWI, Britain captured the land and named it Palestine. There was a little something called the Balfour Declaration that those anti-semitic British assholes never honored, and instead did everything they could to encourage Arabs and discourage Jews from immigrating to Israel, in the hope that the Arabs would massacre the Jews like they did in Hebron in 1929. They also gave 2/3 of the land to the Hashemites and called it Trans-Jordan. World opinion was so opposed to giving the Jews a homeland in 1948, in fact the only reason it happened was do to the diplomacy of an elderly former senator who had a great relation with Mexico, IT WAS A MIRACLE! So who are the Palestinans? The descendants of all the Egyptians, Jordanians, and other Arabs who certainly WERE NOT living in the land 150 years ago, probably weren’t even living there 100 years ago, and maybe weren’t even living there in 1948. Get your history straight! There was never – and there still isn’t – a country called Palestine. There was a territory which was given the name British Palestine about 90 years ago, and 2/3 of that territory is now called Jordan. Israel accepted all the Arab Jews, Jordan and Egypt should take the “Palestinians”, but guess what, they don’t want them. They could have had a Palestinian state any time between 1947 and 1967, but Arabs don’t give a shit about the Palestinians 1% as much as they hate Jews.

  68. 68j on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:46 am:

    i vote to personally give the whole city of new orleans to either side if they promise to stop the freaking killing .that includes getting the native new orleanians to stop killing each other.

  69. 69Tex on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:53 am:

    Muslims never do anything but pick fights they cannot win. Then cry like women when they lose.

    Stop instigating, live in peace and Israel will leave you in peace.

    Keep up the hatred and attacks and Israel will kick your asses until you stop.

    Simple as that. Idiots.

  70. 70Harley2002 on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:53 am:

    Ah the city by the bay. What a cesspool of morons. Oh Barbara how about toning down the BDS he is out of office in 2 weeks not many “Fascist” tactics he can do now. Though I do agree that we should boot these people out of the country. But then again I think we should boot just about everybody in San Fran out of the country, Your city is one sick place.

  71. 71Ian on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:54 am:

    #66 Anonymous doesn’t know what he’s talking about either. The Jews were immigrating before the British took it over, and please research the Balfour Declaration and realize that in actuality the British did everything against the Balfour Declaration, they never followed through with it, and it fact promoted Arab immigration to counter the Jewish immigration. As far as the situation from 1947-1949, the Arabs stole far more Jewish land and money than the Jews ever did from the Arabs, and the Jews took in their Arab brothers while the Arabs put theirs in refugee camps where to this day they are still used as pawns against the state of Israel. The bottom line is that Arabs hate Jews more than they love “Palestinians”. And as far as the 3 billion a year to Israel, Egypt gets over 2 billion a year because they made peace with Israel, if you don’t like it, blame Carter the bean head that he is. It’s really sad how uninformed most Americans are.

  72. 72Jobu on Jan 4, 2009 at 7:02 am:

    You’re either for Civilization or against. That’s really all it comes down to.

    Division into various forms of group thinking is nonsense.

    Life is short; drop the hate and negativity. It’s time to get busy working on improving and advancing civilization.

    It’s easy to destroy and much more difficult to create, maintain and improve.

    It should be clear to you who is on which side of the line.

  73. 73Chegusta on Jan 4, 2009 at 7:13 am:

    I watched the video and I didn’t see Jew-hatred, but rage at Israel and its supporters.

    As for Jews having been there for thousands of years: yes, it is true. The descendants of the Jews have been there for thousands of years, and are fighting for the right to remain there. After adopthing a Jewish sect known as Christianity (most of them) by 1700 years ago and converting to Islam (many but not all of them) 1400 years ago their descendants in what is now Southern Israel (many still Christian) were driven off the land by the Zionists and have been living as refugees in Gaza. They have been cut off from the world, deprived of food and medicine and are facing starvation, but they will not submit. The people of Gaza are the true heirs of Masada, worthy of their ancestors of ancient Judea.

  74. 74Jeremiah on Jan 4, 2009 at 7:13 am:

    Something like 95 % of you on this thread have absolutely no proper sense of history; many of you have things utterly backwards (eg, islam is inspired by nazis? how exactly does a 20th century party/ideology inspire a 7th century religion?). Everybody please take a deep breath, read some actual history of the world, such as noam chomsky and/or howard zinn (as they use actually verifiable facts, as opposed to the contentless value statements that comprise much of history taught in high schools in this country), and then come back and have yourselves some actually informed debate.

  75. 75Chegusta on Jan 4, 2009 at 7:19 am:

    As for racism, its most virulent and dangerous expression in America today is hatred of Moslems and Arabs. People who no longer dare put in print their hatred of Blacks now feel free to call the Palestinians cockroaches and call for their extermination, and the people who manage sites like this treat it as legitimate political expression. It should not be. It should be as much beyond the bounds as calling for the lynching of people with African ancestors.

  76. 76Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 7:20 am:

    They would not pull that crap in a conceal carry state.

  77. 77Joseph Cascio on Jan 4, 2009 at 7:31 am:

    Im sure most of you supporting Israel on this are loyal Americans – but why is it I have met Jewish-Americans who were born here and then serve in the Israeli military over the US. These people should be labeled traitors and not allowed back in the US. Its despicable that they are more loyal to Israel than the US.

  78. 78Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 7:41 am:

    There is great amounts of hate on both sides.

    You should both be ashamed.

    As for me?

    Israel may have been founded illegitamitely, but that doesn’t give Hamas the right to fire explosives into civilian areas. I would be furious as well if some group in Canada starting shooting rockets at an American city.

  79. 79Bob on Jan 4, 2009 at 7:42 am:

    Lots of idiots Hamas supporters here…lol. Read some history ya morons. There are no Palestinians, never really were. During the British rule, the Jews were referred to as Palestinians. Check out this link and edumacate yourselves you bunch of fucktards…..

  80. 80Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 7:43 am:

    What do you expect! Israel is killing women and children as well as the civilian population. This attack on Gaza has been in the works and very well planned by the Jews. What they are doing in Gaza will only bring more anti Jew protest from around the world. It is a shame!

  81. 81Rodney King on Jan 4, 2009 at 7:59 am:

    Can’t we all just get along?

  82. 82allswell on Jan 4, 2009 at 8:05 am:

    “Israel is killing innocents….blah, blah, blah. “Irael is killing terrorists and future terrorists. The Palestinians have a homeland, it’s called Jordan and it is ruled by a Hashemite King. Why doesn’t he let the poor oppressed Palestinians back into their real land? Why don’t any Arab countries actually help them? Because they are ignorant animals who choose death and destruction over progress. Have fun eating shit for the rest of eternity because their are no virgins inn hell.

  83. 83Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 8:10 am:

    i wish there could be cleansing of palestinians, but but its not a surface problem that can be scrubbed cant shine excrement.

    but just posting this in this once-beautiful city is a small ray of sunshine.

    now ,if you feed rats,you get more rats. stop this trash before the border and cut off their welfare.

  84. 84MNproud on Jan 4, 2009 at 8:16 am:

    I hope Israrl does not stop until every Hamas member is turned into ruble and Gaza is a graveyard for all of Hamas!!!

  85. 85Badger on Jan 4, 2009 at 8:19 am:

    Dear Mr Rinkleff

    How do you know that the land was stolen from the “people of Palestine”? What are the people of Palestine anyway? Shall we go into history, you little dumbass? Let’s take Jerusalem. Jerusalm had a population of Christians, Muslims and Jews for hundreds of years. So the “people of Palestine” are what? Christians, Jews and Muslims. OI! What a concept!

    There weren’t just Arabs there, not just muslims. Fact.

    I know, I know, all the terrorist buggers want us to believe that they owned the land. Ok, here’s another little fact to think about: The muslim sphere is… how big exactly? It’s HUGE. The so called “Palestinians”, who shall be called “Judean Arabs” from now on, could go anywhere. There’s is plenty of islamo-fascist states in that area, and pretty much every single one of them is bigger than Israel. But why aren’t those countries taking in the Judean Arabs? Because they know that Hamas and Fatah and all the other goat-fucking, child-raping fascists are nothing else but troublemakers. Heck, even Egypt said that Hamas can only blame itself. Says a lot, doesn’t it?

    And another fact, especially for dhimmis like you, dear Mr Rinkleff (et al), is that islam does not tolerate other religions. Islam only tolerates islam. Islam is peace, that’s what we’re always being told. And that, actually, is true… up to a certain extent. Islam is peace for muslims. If you’re a non-muslim, a non-believer, an infidel in the “pan-islamic terror sphere”… TOUGH LUCK, you’re screwed. You have less rights than muslims, and you get to pay more taxes. Lovely, isn’t it?

    Ah yes, then dhimmis like our dear Mr Rinkleff come with the “but islam forbids killing innocents.” Well, that is true. Killing innocents is not allowed in islam. However, this has a little string attached. Infidels aren’t innocent. They refuse to follow Allah, the god of the great pedophile prophet. Thus, they’re to innocent and can be killed.

    And yes, Mohammed/Muhammed, was a pedophile bastard. Aisha was six years old when she was married to him and she was nine when he penetrated her. That’s the founder of islam. Wonderful guy. If he was alive today, I’d hang him from the highest tower so that the whole world could see his murderous face.

    The goal of Hamas is to destroy Israel (and to kill all Jews). Don’t believe it? Read their charter, it’s all in there, like in Hitler’s “Mein Kampf”. Hamas is also hiding behind women and children, thus Israel can’t really hit them without hitting non-combatants. Tough shit. The pallies could throw out Hamas, but they don’t want to. Fine.

    I say: nuke them. The US has used nukes for less reasons. Israel is fighting for survival against an enemy that wants to kill all Jews. That’s more than enough reason to nuke the islamo-fascists until they glow in the dark.

    Now, back to the fairytale of “land being stolen”. Well, first of, by the time Israel was born, the area belonged to what was once called United Kingdom, known today as Britannistan (or West Pakistan). Before that it had belonged to a so called Ottoman Empire. And before that… well, let’s not go there, it might confuse the uneducated leftists. Fact is, there has never been a “palestinian state”. NEVER. There has, however, been a Jewish kingdom. From the river to the sea, a small, small strip of land (and a thorn in the pan-islamic terror sphere)

    So, everyone in the west, who supports the Hamas and whines about “evil Israel”, this is to you: where have you cowardly bastards been after 9/11? After Madrid? After London? After Mumbai? When muslim terrorists kill “infidels” (and thus follow the orders of the murderous barbarian from the desert known as Mohammed) you are all SILENT. You are fucking cowards. If you like Hamas and islam so much, GO TO IRAN. Enjoy sharia law. And lose your heads within a few days. Because you are infidels. You are pigs and dogs, less than cattle. That’s what the koran says about infidels, Mohammed’s own words. And the koran, my dear leftists, is absolute. If the koran says the world is flat, then the world IS flat. Fact. Maybe people like our dear Mr Rinkleff should read Mohammed’s ~1,400 year old version of “Mein Kampf” before opening their mouths.

    To Israel: good hunting!

    PS: Rinkleff, islam is an ideology (and an ideology of pure and utter oppression), not a race, so by being against islam one can’t be racist. The day the moosels reform their stupid ideology, on that day we can start talking with them. Until then: fix bayonets.

  86. 86Sparky on Jan 4, 2009 at 8:31 am:

    * September 11,2001

    * Multiple commercial airline hijackings/bombings

    * Suicide Bombers that include men, women, and children

    * Chopping off the heads of innocent kidnaped victims and showing it on TV

    * Hanging women for having sex outside marriage, gays for being gay, etc.

    The list could go on….but who engages in this type of behavior? What culture in the world would allow this kind of stuff to go on?

    Give you one guess.

  87. 87Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 8:36 am:

    Helloooo bigots! It’s me again, from #24.

    you dipshits wont believe this, because it wasnt taught in temple but, the fact is, your beloved israel is the despicable bastard child of two extremely greedy nations…the UK and the US. it is nothing more than a geo-political power grab made to ensure a foothold in the oil fields of the middle east. dont be fooled by the supposed religious reasoning or the righteousness of the state of israel. it is a misplaced nation with misguided citizens. Peace in the middle east will never happen as long as this puppet nation continues to bully its neighbors. Long live the PLO

  88. 88Al Talena on Jan 4, 2009 at 8:44 am:

    Hamass played war for years to try & kill Jews while Arabs danced & the world was quite.

    Now its Israel’s turn to play war & the arabs whine like little girls while the Left yells.

  89. 89ishite medraz on Jan 4, 2009 at 8:44 am:

    Go Israel, take care of the terrorists and all of those that support them once and for all.

  90. 90Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 8:50 am:

    amazing how pathetic and scared the ‘right’ is in the eyes of actual human beings!

  91. 91Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 8:54 am:

    Every met a happy Muslim? Amazing how they’ve been drowning in oil money for decades and still don’t have their act together.

  92. 92Jack of All Trades on Jan 4, 2009 at 8:57 am:

    What is a bunch of Central and Eastern European Jews doing in Palestine ?

    God gave it to them ? Haha what a joke. They have no right to be there.

    What kind of religion says to kill everyone and take their land becuase god says so ?

    and even worse thousands of years later, a bunch of Kazars who never ever lived in Palestine

    claim they own they the land. They have turned Palestine into a mirror image of the

    Warsaw ghetho with the roles resersed.

    The problem is that the jews that have gone to Israel, many not all, are the worst

    racists in the world. They will never allow the Palestinians back and the settlers

    in the WB and Jerusalem keep ethnically cleansing more and more Palestinians

    out as they slowing take over the land. The Ashkenazi hate the Sephardi and Ethiopian jews as much as the palestinians. Just read the Israeli papers; bunch of ultra-racists won’t even let the brown skinned jews into their schools. These are the facts.

    Hitler was right, just look at how the Israelis have behaved in Palestine since day 1.

    A bunch of terrorists and genocidal maniacs. There will never be peace since it

    is not in the Israeli vocabulary to give the land back or come to a reasonable

    accommodation about the right of return. They wanted to push all the Palestinians out into Jordan, when that didn’t

    work, they are now trying to keep them trapped in Ghettos. There will never be multicultural society in

    Israel. Just look at how the Israeli Arabs are against the government today or the riots that happen every

    now and then when some racists white dirty jew goes ballistic on some Israeli Arabs.

    The Palestinians should all convert to Judaism temporarily and then claim right of return! Bred like mad,

    and take over the government. This is the only solution for them.

    The only solution for Israel ? there isn’t any. Eventually some Arab is going to get

    some nukes and take Israel out, all the military dominance won’t matter one bit.

  93. 93Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 9:01 am:

    well said jack. nice to see some balance on this peace of shit blog.

  94. 94fred t on Jan 4, 2009 at 9:08 am:

    To: #74 (Jeremiah):

    You lose any credibility in your pro-Islamic murderers defense when you cite Chomsky and Zinn – two far-left hacks who wouldn’t know historical facts if you spoon fed them.

    Israel is right in this fight and deserves all the support those who value freedom can give them.

    From: A Southern patriot.

  95. 95RobertG on Jan 4, 2009 at 9:10 am:

    “”As for racism, its most virulent and dangerous expression in America today is hatred of Moslems and Arabs””

    And why do you think that might be Chegusta ? Could it be flying planes into our buildings, chanting Death to America, planting bombs all over the world? Is that possible? Could it be the murder and persecution of Christians in the Middle East, Egypt, Sudan, Pakistan and Indonesia?

    When we say Palestinians are cockroaches and call for their extermination could that be in self defense? These mohammedans have no intention of getting along with anyone-they demand the right to force us to submit. We demand the right to shoot back, call them cockroaches and exterminate any who do not return to the desert.

    So start packing Ahab.

  96. 96Conscious on Jan 4, 2009 at 9:11 am:

    Just because you are against the Israeli actions does not make you anti-Jewish. I am sick and tired of having that thrown around just because you disagree. The indiscriminate killing and that is what is happening when you launch bombs in heavily population densed area in Gaza is wrong. Ethnic cleansing is wrong. Sucide bombs are wrong. The best thing the US can do is stop supporting unilaterally Israel. Stop sending my tax dollars to butchers. Stop supporting dictartorship around the world.

  97. 97Lisa on Jan 4, 2009 at 9:18 am:

    Every comment was very defined here and came from the heart, with the very exception of a posting by Barbara. You are a very ignorant and prejustice woman that doesn’t deserve to be an American exercising free speech. Since I can’t tell you go to back to our country, please stay home where a wasted mind, body and soul may waste away and may your hatred in time answer to the demons in hell when your time comes. Get educated then speak your mind, for you live in your own world and don’t represent american majority . I am sure you didn’t vote for President Elect Obama either due to the color of his skin and some mis-informed information of muslim background. So what though if he has muslim background? Unlike your narrow minded ignorance and lack of education, at least he is cultural and defined and speaks with value and having education and insight. You get me sick.

  98. 98Jay Stevens on Jan 4, 2009 at 9:24 am:

    And for all of you complaining about a “disproportional response”, a lesson in demographics: There are somewhere around 1.5 billion Muslims world-wide. There are about 15 million Jews world-wide. So killing 100 Muslims for each Jewish casualty is “proportional”.

    From a political viewpoint: the “Palestinians” snatched one Israeli soldier (whom we really do not know if he is alive) and want back 400 or more imprisioned “Palestinians”. So THEY are the ones setting the value of one Israeli.

  99. 99Jack of All Trades on Jan 4, 2009 at 9:27 am:


    this is the biggest lie given by the Israeli-defenders. I guess there were no people in Jerusalem or the other cities ? No arabs/muslims except Bedouins! I guess all those Arab towns and villages didn’t exist!

    The fact is there were a lot of people living there, but no was defending their rights. The Ottomons certaily weren’t.

    Nor where the Bristish. What rights did the British have to give the land to anybody ? The Balfour declaration is joke, basically the Brits said we will give it to the Zionists if the rich jews in America being her over on out side in WWI.

    Again, no one wa protecting the property rights of the original inhabitants. The jews of Europe, the Brits, nor the Americans really had any say over it, other than they could it do it by force. and why did the Brits and Americans, and the rest of Europe let the Zionists come to Palestine ? Because they were just as rasicts and didn’t want all those jews in their countries so they dumped them on the Palestinians.

    The points is that many cultures/peoples were living in Palestine, including jews – peacefully – before the injection of the rasicts and hateful idea of Zionism. Then, its was the promised land only for the jews, death to the Arabs!

    the problem is hateful Zionism and not jews. Zionisms is the Nazi ideology of some jews. Every American should

    be 100% against Zionism; it is completely against American values.

    So the problems of Palestine are the result of the hateful racists ideology of Zionism aided by the racists European and Americans who dumped the whole problem on the Palestinians.

  100. 100tom on Jan 4, 2009 at 9:50 am:

    idiots, the’pasestinians’ are simply the philistines of David fame… child sacrificers. and philistia was what is now gaza. So fine let the philistines have philistia.

  101. 101Leeza on Jan 4, 2009 at 9:51 am:

    I am an Italian American. I was married to a Jew and have children by him. For 17 years I heard him talk bad about Christians and their beliefs. He the born Jew always was a figment of his own imagination and always very narrow minded. His family and him put themselves on a pedalstool of how wonderful and superior they were then others. Very overly confident and hypocrits. They would smile and act to be a friend to all none Jews. But they are prejustice, just not in your face but talk with both sides of their mouth every chance given. The Temple Synagogue in Florida were prejustice and they expressed only views that Jews are the best thing on earth. When I was at that Temple, I felt like I was in a cult and they constantly wanted me to convert. When I finally advised I did not totally follow their rules of Torah and views of the mesiah Elohim and jesus christ, the Rabbi pulled me from teaching school there and eventually insulted me for not thinking like them. My husband any any Jew could do no wrong in their own minds but they surely pointed a stern finger in the face of all others. Vist their site here: Now I am married to an Iranian and I will tell you, I have never felt so informed and enlightened. He is passionate with his words about life, love and religion. His eyes are wide open. He is a medical doctor and so compassionate about life and values the belief and opinions of others. However, he felt so threatened and singled out always when traveling. I know first hand because he was traveling back to Iran he was singled out, pulled out of line for a Homeland Secuirty interrogation that always denied him his flight out. They interrogated him and kept him against his will and asked him such embarassing, intrusive, discriminatory questions. He tried to defend himslef peacefully by saying he was a educated, honest man and medical docttor and would like to be appreciated by the secuirty and be free to go. He stated the California Homeland security people kept him locked inside a box of glass and people walked by and stared at him as if he was a criminal. He stated he was kept there with no handle on the door to leave and no rights. That is false imprisonment as I know it. He wasn’t free to leave, was being interrogated and was strippped of any rights. Yet my ahbibi kept true to form and accepted that he was endure these acts by america until one day their view points change about the mideast. The only way change will occur is with talk, negotiation and demonstrations as doen here in California today. As American’s say, the sqeecky wheel gets the grease. God Bless Everyone, whoever your god is or whether you don’t believe in a God at all, this is your choice and not mind or others. May peace be unto all in this world we all share together. No more hurt. Please stop these killings, these wars, these split tongues and divided nations.

  102. 102MelMaguire on Jan 4, 2009 at 9:51 am:

    ISRAEL is killing women and children? What about what Hamas has done? I love how the Palestinian supporters and anti-Semitic bigots on this thread are so quick to point out who Israel is killing while they conveniently leave out the facts about what has truly gone on for the past ten years or so.

    Somewhere around 500 Israeli civilians have been murdered in attacks perpetrated by Hamas since the year 2000. Suicide bombings on buses, rocket attacks from Gaza, shootings, you name it, they’ve done it. One of the most gruesome attacks took place in May of 2004, when a carload of Hamas terrorists pulled up beside a car carrying a pregnant Israeli and her four daughters. They riddled the car with bullets, then when it crashed they got out and shot each of them at close range, riddling their bodies with bullets. And that’s just a single incident.

    You wanna talk about killing women and children? Chew on that, you worthless fucknuts.

  103. 103tom on Jan 4, 2009 at 9:51 am:

    make that palestinians

  104. 104I am a Jew on Jan 4, 2009 at 9:54 am:

    For 1400 hundres years we are suffering from Muslim opression all the way from Mohhamad to Uday and Qusay Hussien. From Jiziya Extra Jew tax to muslims to being called Dhimi Second class citizens. today in Israel no longer do we have to suffer under opressed islam.

  105. 105American on Jan 4, 2009 at 9:57 am:


    1)the arab palestinians were in palestine before the Jewish Population migrated en mass in the early 1900’s and during world war II.

    The Israeli population has tried to cover this fact by making claims there was NO state or no arabs at the time. However the arabs had been previously Occupied by the English and French and the creation of the “arab” states and Israel was drawn up according to their desires upon withdrawal. Israel was “given” to the jewish world by the Western world (England, France, US) in some sort of misguided payment for thier help during world war II.

    For those who would erase history – look up the Balfour Declaration and its historic discussion.

    2)WHY DID THE ARABS HAVE TO PAY FOR WESTERN GUILT OF ANTI-SEMITISM AFTER WORLD WAR II? Hundreds of thousands of arabs were displaced forcibly – the ones remaining are the ones who stayed – their population has grown to the millions



  106. 106Rational Being on Jan 4, 2009 at 9:59 am:

    The level of hate by the supporters of Gaza and Hamas and their “radical” allies is unbelievable. Certainly reasonable minds can differ on the specifics of the situation, but the bottom line seems to be that Hamas and their radical supporters are in favor of ethnic cleansing and killing Jews. The fact is that Israel is here to stay. That is a reality on the ground that is not going to change. There will certainly be a Palestinian state soon as there should be. I don’t know allot about Islam, but everything I see seems to say that it is a religion of hatred and a desire to kill anyone that is not a Muslim. The degree of just outright vile hatred on the part of Hamas, and their friend, even before the current war started, is the thing that stands out the most. As long as one group takes the position that the other does not have the right to exist, it certainly limits that options for peace. It seems Hamas does not want peace or even a peaceful co-existence. The reality is that nothing will make that Hamas protestors happy, short of allot of dead Jews. Let’s face fact-killing Jews is really their agenda.

  107. 107Kamikaze87 on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:02 am:

    I hate to be a nitpick. But it’s spelled Martial Law, and the last time that was implemented was in New Orleans during Katrina, and the time before that, I believe was in WWII when we “made” Hawaii a territory of the US. I just think they all need to get over their damn differences, shut the hell up, sit the fuck down, and quit bombing each other. Honestly…religious zealots need to just shut the fuck up and keep their hands to themselves. It’s like the whole fucking world is 12 years old. Really? You can’t handle your disagreements like fucking adults? Fuck it, leave them all in the hell they’ve created.

  108. 108Rule Number One on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:04 am:

    Palestinian’s have been screwed by both the Arabs and the Israelis from the get go.

    To the Arabs they are nothing but cannon fodder.

    To the Jews they represent the failure of an indigenous people to cow tow to a dictate created by a group of nations (the United States included) based on N.I.M.B.Y.

    Think I’m kidding?

    Google “Slattery Report”.

  109. 109Jesus on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:07 am:

    your all pieces of (expletive) the israelis are no better than the janjaweed in Darfur

  110. 110Jesus on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:07 am:

    your all pieces of (expletive) the israelis are no better than the janjaweed in Darfur

  111. 111Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:11 am:

    I can,t believe the ignorance of so many people that still want a self declared terrorist org to run a country who starts shooting rockets into Israel with no shame please give me a brake!

  112. 112American on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:18 am:


    1)the arab palestinians were in palestine before the Jewish Population migrated en mass in the early 1900’s and during world war II.

    The Israeli population has tried to cover this fact by making claims there was NO state or no arabs at the time. However the arabs had been previously Occupied by the English and French and the creation of the “arab” states and Israel was drawn up according to their desires upon withdrawal. Israel was “given” to the jewish world by the Western world (England, France, US) in some sort of misguided payment for thier help during world war II.

    For those who would erase history – look up the Balfour Declaration and its historic discussion.

    2)WHY DID THE ARABS HAVE TO PAY FOR WESTERN GUILT OF ANTI-SEMITISM AFTER WORLD WAR II? Hundreds of thousands of arabs were displaced forcibly – the ones remaining are the ones who stayed – their population has grown to the millions

    HOW MANY OF YOU WELL INFORMED PEOPLE KNOW THAT THE OTHER SITE PROPOSED AS THE STATE OF ISRAEL WAS IN ARGENTINA???????? Can you imagine who would be fighting who if this was all in argentina?

    3) The thought that you can let 7 million people of any nation be raised for the last 50 years under occupation and TORTURE – yes Israel tortures Arab males in prisons and then re-releases them into population. Now I am opposed to the violence on both sides- but you are a hypocrit if you are claiming that the arab men and women living under these conditions are behaving any differently then you would under the same conditions. Take a good look in the mirror.

    4) Hamas does not represent all the arabs- the arabs are pissed they have been invaded, their relatives are being killed by 1 ton bombs dropped on the home of a militant leader and they are just “collateral damage”. Do you think any American or Israeli would accept being “collateral damage”- you are really pushing the laugh factor test if you want us to believe that. ” She was at Starbauch’s having a coffee- and guess who was sitting next to her- it was leader of that famous Elsalvadoran Gang. Well the cops just unloaded a huge bomb on the place and mom and her cafe au lait were history. Oh well, sure am glad they got him- he was a murderer.” Yeah that’s how you would take it.


  113. 113Chilled on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:19 am:

    The Nazi salutes at 1:58 are particularly chilling. Why didn’t San Francisco “progressives” protest Hamas lobbing 10,000+ bombs into Israel over the last several years? Because they aren’t progressive.

  114. 114Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:21 am:

    I,m sure Israel did not want to wait for the masia to take matters into ther own hands .Cause when this incompetent president ;that has no clue of whats at stake here get,s into office Israel whants a head start.It,s going to be a very tuff time but I believe that Israel will get the job done or at least reduce there power of these adicals that no matter how hard you hit them they keep on popping up like flies.May god give the power to his people to overcome this prosses.

  115. 115Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:22 am:

    Time to wipe these bastards out who live on our streets and are tolerate by us

  116. 116Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:22 am:

    In answer to the complaints about the SFPD and their disinclination to “get involved” you must look to American Jewry which has been in the vanguard of anti-police lawsuits since the 1960’s. I noticed the police were wearing soft hats and regulation-size batons (rather than the longer riot batons). This is a result of the ACLU and the MSM always describing helmeted police as garbed in SWAT gear or riot gear. The SFPD commanders decided that they would prefer a less intimidating uniform for their officers and just try to keep the demonstrators apart using French barriers. Stop blaming the police and look up the road to the Berkeley campus. That is where your real internal enemy resides. The American Jews decided years ago to ally themselves with American African-Americans in a fight for human rights. Now take a look around you and see who truly despises you…not the police and not the average American European-American. You reap what you sow.

  117. 117Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:24 am:

    105, please don’t tell us you’re an American. You’re not.

    But what you are is a typical Islamonazi fascist roach fece.

    If San Francisco had been shelled by enemy warships or rocketed from Nevada, I highly doubt a little pervert like Gavin Newsom or the Gay boys on Castro or Folsom would sit still, or for that matter the other so-called “progressives” – read Nazis of the Left. They’d probably grab every member of ANSWER or the local Paly Muslim terror community they could find and hang them.

  118. 118Rational Being on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:25 am:

    The other thing that occurred to me in reading these blogs is this–, Israel is only doing what Hamas wishes they could do to Israel. If it was reversed, then Hamas and their radical friends were invading Israel, these Hamas supporters would presumably be jumping for joy in the street that Jews were being killed. The difference of course is that Israel recognizes that there will be a two state solution, and that eventually, there will be a very prosperous state of Palestine, where Palestinians will have great universities, an Olympic team, great scholars, medical centers, tourists from around the world, etc. That is all possible. But that is not the Hamas vision. When a Palestinian state is finally established, ironically it will have been Israel more then any Arab nations that is responsible, because the Arab world had numerous chances for many years to help create a Palestinian state. It will be the hated Jews that are instrumental in building such a state, and will likely be Palestine’s leading trade partner and source of employment for many Palestinians not to mention a partner when it comes to water, regional economic development, etc. When will the Palestinians wake up and finally understand that Hamas is not much of a future.

  119. 119Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:25 am:

    Eretz Israel Shlema!!!!! Yehuda, Shomron VEGaza!!!!!!

  120. 120Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:25 am:

    Mel McGuire,

    Thank you!!!

  121. 121Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:26 am:

    Please Please everyone! Can no-one associated with this stream either keep a rational string of thoughts going without unnecessary, biased and often justy plain rude sniping? Also can people not segregate the protests from what is actually happening? Yes, if these phases were chanted then the people responsible should be roundly condemned by all sensible observers, but this in itself is nothinjg to do with the slaughter of innocent civillians ON BOTH SIDES of this terrible, but seemingly unavoidable conflict. It is up to those who read and comment on blogs to occasionally act like adults.

  122. 122bj on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:28 am:

    i think its interesting how 99.9 percent of the pro-israili crowd are using curse words to stress their points. unfortunately, it makes their comments that much more racist, prejudiced, etc.

    And FYI everyone, all Islamic scholars completely condemn suicide bombing. killing ppl is forbidden in Islam unless in times of war. GOd says: Whosoever among you kills one soul, it is as if he killed all of Mankind. FACT. read the Quran.

    palestinians HAVE done alot of wrong, esp Hamas, who has no concept of brotherhood and is TILL NOW fighting with Fath. However, the solution is not killing hundreds of people right and left.

    peace and love to all humans )

  123. 123Ruth on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:31 am:

    #67- You are right on track! The Jews do have the right to be in Israel and after thousands of years with no homeland, they belong in Israel. The Arab countries in the middle east need to accept this.

  124. 124John Myers on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:37 am:

    Israel murders, and Palistinians who protest are the ones in the wrong? What nonsense. The ceasefire held, by the way, until Israel (as usual) started its crossborder raids killing Hamas members back in November. If Hamas had killed members of Israels parlament, Israel wouldnt have responded? More nonsense.. The plan for invasion of Gaza has been in the works for 6 months anyway (according to Israeli officials) so the rocket fire from Hamas is just another Israeli pretext for Israeli violence against anyone who wont accept the rather bizzare idea that a bunch of people from Brooklyn, Poland, Russia etc. have more of a right to a strip of land in the Mid East land than the people who have been inhabiting it for the last 1000 years. In the end, Hamas will only be strengthened by all of this, leading to more bloodshed.

  125. 125Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:44 am:

    Some of the worst monsters in the world seem to reserve a special hatred for the Jews. It’s been consistent throughout the last couple of millenia.

    You may think that WWII was an unmixed victory for the allies, and a definitive rescue of the Jewish people. I invite you to review those notions.

    If you’re not getting this, take the words of the anti-Israel arabs, and substitute the name of almost any other people for the word Jew, you’ll see instantly what’s going on.

    For you confused Americans – If China came to the US in 1950 and gave, say, the Okeefenokee swamo to the blacks to make a state of their own. And if that state became the best place to live in the American south … what do you think the KKK would have been doing and saying all this time ????????

    Make no mistake about it, the nazis are back in the person of the Arabs around Israel, and the fashionable people of this world have been suckered into cheering for the wrong side of the fight.

  126. 126Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:45 am:

    Terrorist threats, assault and battery, public nuisance, to name a few. And this was allowed to go on. What is happening to our juridical system. Next to be attacked will be the Catholics, Mormons, Lutherans, Baptist, all religions as we now know them, that built this grate country.

    Answer: Send the protester to there country of org en, were they can exercise there right.

  127. 127Gandhi-vadi on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:46 am:

    “An eye for an eye will make the world blind”… the conflict or attack and then retaliaton has been going on for ever with NO OUTCOME and peace. Handful of people on both side decide the fate of millions on both the side. You guys can opion all about it sitting in the comfort of US. But seeing someone close gone is always painful regardless who you are. Channel your anger to your leaders and ask them to talk it through – again and again and again. And BTW if didn’t know non-violence takes more courage than firing a bullet. Let peace be upon both Isreal & Palastine!!

  128. 128Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:47 am:

    after reading all the comments ive realized that neither side knows an objective history. both sides try to skew the facts in the way that suits their cause. with so much blind hatred on both sides, i think the only answer is to wipe em both off the face of the earth. im not anti-palestine or anti-israel, im anti-idiots-who-fuck-things-up-for-everyone-else.

  129. 129Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:48 am:

    I hope israel just bombs the crap out of them They are to stupid to understand anything else.

  130. 130Hector Marroquin on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:49 am:

    Those scary looking Palestenian Protesters in San Francisco dressed themselves to look like terrorist not only hate Israel but America as well.

  131. 131Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:55 am:

    We need to put the Jews in Concentration camps. It is the only way to get our media and banking system back. Long live the USA death to baby killer Jews!!!!

  132. 132Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 11:01 am:

    I say Jest Give the ARABS the same guns and weapons we gave the JEWS and let them fight it out. Without our support the Jews done have the back bone to fight. They have a strong army only if they are fighting defenseless women and children. We saw how they lost to Hezbolah and ran with their tail between their legs when fighting real soldiers. Israeli spies try to defend them here and accuse every patriotic American of Antisemitism but every one knows the truth despite their control of our media and the corrupt politicians. They under estimate the intelligence of the American Public. READ HENRY FORDS INTERNATIONAL JEW!!!!

  133. 133Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 11:05 am:

    >>here’s a big FUCK YOU to all the ZIONIST SCUM who think that dropping US BOMBS out of US WARPLANES and KILLING INNOCENTS– mothers, babies, and non-violent GAZA SUFFERERS is a good thing. what if the tables were turned and the ISRAELI COWARDS only had non-guided, big bottle-rockets to fire at their OPPRESSORS?? what then? would JEWS world wide be TERRORISTS for FIGHTING FOR THEIR HUMAN RIGHTS?<<

    “Fighting for their human rights”? What the hell is wrong with you? The Palestinians have their own land, however small it may be (Israel isn’t that big, either), and they have the right to govern themselves. They could do anything they wanted, and if they really wanted to live peacefully side by side with Israel, Israel would gladly do it – how tired do you think the Israelis are of the constant fighting for their very survival that has been going on for over 2000 years? But no. Instead of trying to peacefully build their society, the Palestinians use their land as a launching point for CONSTANT attacks against Israel. In response, Israel shows INHUMAN restraint, trying desperately to negotiate a peaceful end to all the hostilities. And when they finally get fed up and decide to take action to protect their people, the world condemns them and calls ISRAEL the bad guys. The world media writes stories about all the poor, poor Palestinian “civillians” (many of whom are Hamas terrorists hiding among the civillian populace) who are being killed, and they run pictures of crying babies and wounded people, never showing the same crying babies and wounded people in Israel who have been injured or killed by unprovoked rocket attacks. HAMAS’ hands are stained with the blood of the Palestinian people, NOT Israel. If Mexicans were launching rockets into Texas and the Mexican government refused to do anything about it, the US would take steps to defend its citizens – and rightly so, since that is the responsibility of government. So explain to me why Israel’s government doesn’t have the right to do the same thing for its citizens who are being injured or killed by a bunch of terrorists. What you damn bleeding hearts don’t seem to get is that Hamas – and Hezbollah, and Iran, and everyone else – doesn’t WANT a peaceful solution to the Arab/Israeli conflict. They don’t WANT to live side by side in peace with Israel. They want Israel dismembered and destroyed, and Jews wiped out. AND YOU IDIOTS ARE SIDING WITH THEM! You’re essentially siding with people who think the same way Hitler did. Does that make you proud? DOES IT!?!?

  134. 134globalindian on Jan 4, 2009 at 11:11 am:

    It is easy to feel for palestinians. i cringe when i hear right wing nut jobs. and my best friends are muslims with wonderful families. however, it is increasingly becoming difficult for me to comprehend the madness from some in the muslim community who are living in the past. and believe only in their religion. as one of the posters said, unless there is reform and a message of peace from the mullahs or driven educated muslims that it is ok to be non-muslim and non-muslims have a right to live their life, the clash of civilizations will continue. and it comes down to protecting my family, i have no muslim friends!

  135. 135tom on Jan 4, 2009 at 11:14 am:

    damn right!!!

  136. 136Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 11:15 am:

    This article is full of lies and exaggeration. I was at both protests and they were totally peaceful even though people with Israeli flags kept running into marches and trying to incite confrontations. That is a video of somebody throwing an Israeli flag on the ground out of someone’s hands. While not ideal for a protest, with all the murders going on in Gaza that was the most violent thing that occurred in these demonstrations and that isn’t violence at all (nobody was hurt).

    You are also trying to lie about the chants. The chants were all “Stop Bombing Gaza” “Free, Free Palestine” “From the River To The See Palestine Will Be Free” etc… This was a peaceful protest with many many Jews coming out to support Palestine. This is not about religion and you are heavily distorting the facts about a peaceful protest.

  137. 137Kandi on Jan 4, 2009 at 11:48 am:

    The hateful messages on this message board sound very much like those of terrorist groups. That should make Americans afraid. There have been so many oppurtunities for Americans to do the right thing and we keep missing the chance. It is true that these wars have been going on for decades but it never stops saddening me that innocent people are dying. That is the point. It doesn’t matter who you sympathize with. There are people dying!!!!!! And by the way just becasue there are gay people in San Fransico doesn’t make it immune to ignorance. And also I fail to see the correlation other than to get a bunch of people who are already full of hate even more stirred up.

  138. 138kiano on Jan 4, 2009 at 11:52 am:

    Goes to show how ignorant we Americans are..

    Why not know the history before deciding on whos the evil and who is not?

    Do your research and you will know exactly who is the “outsider” and whose land it is. me it does not even matter whose land it originally was – as the fact remains

    that both are sharing the place now, but why is it that Israel feels compelled to occupy more and more land and places in Palestine? Some ppl here posted that Palestinians are committing a genocide in Israel. How is it really possible as their main weapon is stone. They use 3 foot long cloth to hurl stones at the bomb-proof thats dangerously close to committing genocide :). Actually few times they cannot even throw stones as those tanks have palestinan civilians being used as human shields.

    I think we can be as ignorant as we want.. but to form hard opinions and posting and promoting something that you really wouldnt (if you knew). I sincerely request all to not to support killing of innocent civilians without knowing anything or by just thinking you know by just watching few minutes of Fox or even CNN.

    Some interesting facts

    Most Israeli soldiers die of guilt – not explosions or bullets. They commit suicide after seeing what they seen or doing what they have done. If 6 Israeli soldiers die in firing, 30 die by committing suicide.

  139. 139German1937 on Jan 4, 2009 at 11:52 am:

    Iran is “hidden” , secret leader, supplier of funds and weapons, and director of the demonstrations here in America, Iraq, Palastine, Spain, England,, Jordan, Lebanon, Turkey, and the Arab Emirate States. They do it through “proxies’ , Hamas, Hezbolla, PLO, Syria,Taliban,”Muslim” cleric militias, etc. Iran is the real and true villan and our enemy. You may ask “why”? The answer is that their goal is to gain control, parcel by parcel,state by state, country by country, the entire middle east which has over 50% of the entire world’s oil reserve beneath it. Control that, and you control all oil dependent countries world wide, their monetary system/economy, and their people. Unless America, it’s friends and allies, with their leaders and citizens wake up,”smell the coffee cooking” so to speak, the west is in for some extremely troubled and painfull years ahead. We cannot wait any longer. As for this demonstration, and all the others that have taken place in the USA, they are but distractions for we Americans to focus on, while they, the Iranians pursue their secret goal of taking over the middle east. Should we stop them? No, that is not the American way. We should allow them, but arrest any and all that ‘break our laws’, and deport anyone that is not an American citizen that breaks our laws, be he Arab, Muslim, Jew, Pole, German, Syrian, etc. The rule of law should apply.

  140. 140Ripper on Jan 4, 2009 at 11:53 am:

    I see the palestinians you have in the USA acts exactly like the ones we have in Denmark , that is like savages who is only capable of destroying the contry they now reside in – just like they did to their own contry…

  141. 141God on Jan 4, 2009 at 11:55 am:


    This is God. Thought i’d drop by and say that i’ll be dropping a giant lightning bolt down on both of you and obliterating you from the map.

  142. 142Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 11:58 am:

    Oh, and here’s one more little tidbit for you:

    It doesn’t matter whether you believe that Israel was founded illegitimately or not. The simple fact is that it exists, and those who hate it need to get over it and deal with that fact. There was a time not long ago when there was no such thing as Kuwait. The British sectioned Kuwait off when they withdrew from the Persian portion of their empire and gave it independence. So, by the standards of the anti-Israel people, Kuwait is an illegitimate country as well, since there were people living there at the time of Kuwait’s formation who didn’t want to be part of the new country. Yet, NO ONE claimed that Iraq was “fighting for its freedom” when Saddam invaded Kuwait in ‘91, and the whole world banded together to toss him out, counting Desert Storm as a righteous use of military force.

    There was also a point in time, not long ago, when there was no such thing as the country of Pakistan. Pakistan was once part of India, but again, when the British withdrew, they sectioned off Pakistan and gave it independence. Many people who lived in Pakistan considered themselves Indians and were unhappy about the creation of a new country, wishing instead to remain part of India. So, by the standards of the anti-Israel folks here, Pakistan is also an illegitimate country. Yet, if India invaded and conquered Pakistan – essentially reuniting what was once a single country – people world wide would scream bloody murder and accuse India of blatant, aggressive imperialism and demand that they restore Pakistan to its independence. In fact, they’d go so far as to compare India to the British empire.

    Yet, these same people call Israel a terrorist state, and call them murderers and compare them to THE NAZIS of all people, and accuse them of perpetrating a HOLOCAUST against the Palestinians, because Israel, after demonstrating EXTREME patience with Hamas, finally decides to use military force to protect itself and its people. Listen. Get down off your ideological high horse, stop smoking so much weed, and look at just how deep your hypocracy runs. Whether you, the Palestinians, the Iranians, Syrians, or anyone else likes it or not, ISRAEL IS A NATION AND IT’S NOT GOING ANYWHERE. DEAL WITH IT. Israel has as much right to exist as any other nation, ESPECIALLY since there’s not a nation on earth that was formed without displacing SOMEONE. It doesn’t matter how the country was formed, the fact is that it was formed, and it has as much and as legitimate a right as any other nation to exist. For the Palestinians to dispute this (or the Iranians or any other middle eastern nation, most of whom were only recently formed from the wreckage of the British Empire) is for them to call into dispute their OWN right to exist, since they would ALSO be a nation formed out of another nation.

    The ideal solution to this problem would be for everyone who lives in the territory of Israel/”Palestine” to simply say “Screw It”, put down their weapons, stop all the arguing and fighting, and go live their lives as they see fit. In short, take advantage of the God-given freedom they have and make something of their lives. But, this is not going to happen. Not because the Israelis don’t want it to, but BECAUSE THE “PALESTINIANS” DON’T WANT IT TO. They refuse to live in peace with Israel, and will not rest until it’s destroyed. So, since Israel has every right to exist and live in peace, and since the “Palestinians” (and their Muslim buddies throughout the middle east) refuse to allow this to happen, the only solution is to pound the bad guys – the “Palestinians” and their Muslim buddies – into the ground until they simply cannot lift a finger to hurt anyone, anymore, ever again. I recognize that not all Muslims agree with the things that those “Muslim buddies” I mentioned are doing, so I should clarify here that I’m referring to any Muslim group who calls for the destruction of Israel, rather than peaceful coexistence with Israel. Personally, I’d prefer the peaceful coexistence, but the truth is that some people just don’t want that, and you CANNOT negotiate with someone for whom peace means the complete destruction of you and all you stand for. You bleeding hearts need to get this through you heads: Sometimes there simply is no peaceful solution.

  143. 143Marine84 on Jan 4, 2009 at 12:06 pm:

    Let them demonstrate, identify themselves to us, but if they violate and truly break any of our laws, arrest them, prosacute them in our court of law, and place them behind bars . The funny part is this

    No world-wide demonstrations when ARABS kill other ARABS and US Troops..

    No world-wide demonstrations when ARABS kill Africans in Dar-fur

    No world-wide demonstrations when almost a million are killed in RU-WANDA

    What’s wrong with the picture in America????????????????????????????????? Think about the above

  144. 144Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 12:12 pm:

    Anyone interested in the modern history of the state of Israel can quickly learn the jist of the situation by googling “state of israel” or the like. Start with the Wikipedia entry, and you’ll find more links, perhaps, than you’ll want or need to pursue.

    Yes, the current geopolitical situation is basically an outcome of WWII–or, to my way of thinking, the two World Wars. A new geopolitical system, as it were, emerged in the 20th century; we know it was a seriously major realignment and reconfiguration of geopolitical reality because of the magnitude of the World Wars that apparently were necessary to, well, “clarify” the situation. Big nation-states were certainly well on their way when the United States came into being, but their ultimate (”perfected”?) form emerged in and through the World Wars. After WWII, they had to deal with a new reality. They could have done things differently, but whatever they did, it would have been the outcome of the war. That’s when the winners and losers acknowledge the situation and settle up, according to generally understood (amongst the combatants) customs, or “rules of war.” The issues in these posts must of had little to zero place in the decisions.

    So the question isn’t Who has a “right” to statehood in the region. The question is, Who is paying for this ongoing conflict, and why?

    As for “hate,” that dreadfully overused word (up there with “rights”), every post that has accused the other side of “hate” has, at the same time, declared an implacable hate for the other side, usually with the implication that the other side is composed of haters who are also objectively hate-able.

  145. 145Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 12:13 pm:

    There are not many of them left, but what do Palestinian Christians think of the situation in Palestine? Although it is hard to generalize you will discover that they really don’t like the PLO, and even less so, Hamas, but they ultimately truly hate Israel. Therefore, the anti-Israel reaction of Palestinians is not just about religion.

    Even though AIPAC suggests otherwise, I, as a Christian of Jewish heritage, harbor grave guilt over the fact that my US tax dollars are going to kill many people who are NO threat to me or my country. If Palestinians and Israelis are locked in an intractible hundred year war, let ‘em fight it out, but leave the US out of something that is not our war.

  146. 146Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 12:17 pm:

    You are talking about those jews like they are some harmless people who were scatered around the globe for no good reason , has anyone read the The Merchant of Venice, has anyone read their history from old times till now , AND FINALLY : did anyone actually saw the news recently ??!!

    more than 500 dead and 2000 injured 30% of them are women and children , and you are defending for the ones who are boming those people , wake up , and dont tell me it’s all about hamas, cauz from what I saw hamas was not the target, I mean common, did you see their targets recently , they are targeting homes!!! PEOPLE , I wouldn’t be surprised if they NUKE the place instead, that would clear out hamas, and about 1 million people.

  147. 147Muhamad Bendover on Jan 4, 2009 at 12:19 pm:

    Yes they are targeting homes have have weapons caches in them. Stores of rockets and mortars and machine guns. Good for the Israeli’s to have the balls to fight a tough war. More than I can say for you pussies who sit by, letting Israel be attacked daily by Hamas and do or say nothing.

  148. 148Dr. Neil Dobro on Jan 4, 2009 at 12:19 pm:

    As an ardent Zionist and organizer of many Pro-Israel demonstartions: the 5 pro-Israel counter demonstartors were foolish and adventuristic. Whatever their motives, they were at least misguided. Of course there were going to be at least a few hot headed leftists or Islamists in the demonstration. Of course they were going to attack Jews with Israel’s flag.

    This puts a damper on other actions for our side: our people want nothing to do with violence.

    If I may abandon tact for one moment. . . . .YOU SCHMUKS ! You’ve hurt Israel.

  149. 149KSS on Jan 4, 2009 at 12:20 pm:

    “here’s a big FUCK YOU to all the ZIONIST SCUM who think that dropping US BOMBS out of US WARPLANES and KILLING INNOCENTS–”

    You have a good point there, I much preferred it when the IAF was using the French built Mirage III’s, they just had more…style.

    God’s speed to the IDF. Put an end to Hamas in Gaza for good this time.

  150. 150Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 12:23 pm:

    This is really funny. I post pro-Israel comments on here and they misteriously dissapear. Typical left wing censorship

  151. 151jcila on Jan 4, 2009 at 12:33 pm:

    Muslims need to start taking a real hard look at their so called “relibion of peace”

    If islam is so wonderful and peaceful then please explain why?

    99.82 % of all suicide (homicide bombers are muslim)

    99.999% of all beheaders are muslim (there was 1 official report of a hindu beheading a muslim) and was quickly condemnded but not the `10’s of thousands of infidels butchered by muslims

    99.3% of all terrorist attacks were committed by muslims (only using official reported attacks) in the main stream media

    100% of all muslim mosques declare the intentions of muslims to “Wipe out the jews” unquote.

    So please spare me the BULL CRAP of telling me how wonderful islam is..

    You muslims need to read the bible and then REPENT for Jesus is comming very soon.

    And the entire world will see him..

    And do you know why i can say this with such certanty?

    Just use a little logic please?

    If Jesus is God then surly he can back it up (hmm)? wouldnt you think?

    If mohammed and alah are god surly he can PROVE IT..

    but there is the rub for i know that only Jesus can PROVE it..

    while islam cannot..

  152. 152zombie on Jan 4, 2009 at 12:48 pm:

    Hi, this is the blog moderator here.

    This thread is completely infested with trolls and mobys. A substantial portion of the comments on this post are phony, voicing extreme opinions to discredit the opposing side.

    I’ve deleted some of the worst offenders, but from this point onward, I have no time or interest to monitor each comment to make sure trolls are not up to their tricks again. Take each comment here with a big grain of salt, and don’t assume that because someone is expressing an extreme opinion in one direction that they actually believe what they’re writing. Mostly, these comments are being written by leftists who are (not very believably) pretending to be racists who are pro-Israel, in order to discredit the Israeli side.

    So, if you keep reading, beware: comments below this point are unmoderated and of unknown sincerity and provenance.

  153. 153Jerry on Jan 4, 2009 at 12:58 pm:

    What would the United States or any other country do if we were under a daily rocket barrage for years on end with no end in sight? The U.S. was hit by just one (terrible) terrorist attack on 911 and we went off and started two wars (Afghanistan and Iraq) on the other side of the globe. W’re still fighting them to this day. Israel has been putting up with, on a daily basis, thousands upon thousands of rocket and mortar fire from Gaza for years now. Israel has every right to use whatever means necessary to defend herself. Any hardships and suffering that Gaza’s residents are facing right now, they only have themselves to blame – for putting that Jew hating, Iran/Syria supported terrorist organization Hamas in power and allowing them to turn their mosques and homes and neighborhoods into terror bases. Israel doesen’t deliberately target civilians as a matter of official government policy and they have exercised the utmost in restraint against a bunch of Islamo-fascist thugs who have sworn their eternal hatred for Jews and their determination to wipe them off the face of the map. The Middle East is a very dangerous neighborhood and Israel and Jews will never again roll over and be marched calmly to the ovens and gas chambers as the world yawns. Jews have ALWAYS had a physical presence in the land of Palestine and the Palestinans have NEVER had their OWN country there. That is fact and not conjecture. At the most, that whole area is only ‘contested’ land but by no means is it ‘occupied’ as the liars of Islam so vehemently proclaim. If it is occupied at all then it is occupied by the Palestinian thugs who call themselves Hamas/PLO/Fatah.

  154. 154Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 1:01 pm:

    Oh, and you leftists out there should be REALLY careful about the languge you use. You throw around terms like “genocide”, “ethnic cleansing”, and “holocaust”, and use them to describe Israeli activities. Those terms have ACTUAL meanings, not subjective meanings that you can randomly assign as you see fit. I know your wrong-headed leftist ideology tells you that everything is relative, and I know your idiotic, outcome-based educators who run the schools in the US teach you that words don’t really have any firm meaning, and allow you to abuse the English language as you see fit, but that’s no excuse. Those words describe specific, horrendous kinds of actions, the kinds of action that Jews throughout history have been victims of, not perpetrators of. You need to watch your mouth and choose your words more carefully.

    See, the thing is, anti-semitism has not gone away with the destruction of the Third Reich. It has simply disguised itself as Pro-Palestinian sentiment. People who claim to be Pro-Palestinian are often anti-semites who use their supposed support for “Palestine” as a cover to vent their anti-semitic sentiments. The truth is, though, that regardless of religion or culture, a country has EVERY right to defend its citizens from attack by ANYONE, whether that attacker be another country or a terrorist group mascarading as a legitimate government, like Hamas. Honestly, with no malice toward those “Palestinians” who desire nothing more than to live in peace, I hope Israel finds every single one of the terrorists they’re after and gives them the hard goodbye. And, yes, I’d say the same thing if the roles were reversed, or if it was two different countries. Terrorists deserve WHATEVER they get, and if that happens to be a flaming, agonizing, high-explosive death, well, maybe the next group will think twice before they decide to act stupid. And when the peaceful “Palestinians” want someone to blame for the deaths of their friends and families, I hope they march straight to whatever mosque Hamas is using as a headquarters today and lay the blame squarely where it belongs – PAINFULLY.

  155. 155Tantor on Jan 4, 2009 at 1:08 pm:

    The reason why Muslims flood the streets of San Francisco to support Hamas against Israel is the same reason why Muslims are demonstrating in cities around the world: Mohammed commanded them with his last words to conquer the world for Islam. This is one battle in their jihad. They intend to convert, subjugate, or kill everyone in the world. This demonstration is a step towards that.

    I’m also struck by the fact that ANSWER, the Stalinist front group, sponsors these demonstrations all across America. It costs tens of thousands of bucks to sponsor such a demonstration, about $50,000 for five or ten thousand marchers. It must take a million bucks to sponsor simultaneous pro-Hamas demonstrations in big cities across America, even if leveraged by willing Muslims to man them. Where does ANSWER get that money? A Congressional investigator who has examined such radical organizations says no large protest organization exists without foreign support. ANSWER refuses to disclose their financial patrons, with good reason. My guess is that in this case it is the Saudis.

  156. 156Julia on Jan 4, 2009 at 1:08 pm:

    Ian on post #67 & post # 71 is in fact accurate in his historical knowledge. Chegusta, post # 73 & #75 is a very reasonable sympathizer for Palestineans, but does not know the historical origin of the refugee camps & Palestinean Territory. The area that is now Israel, save Jerusalem only, was desert ruin 150 years ago. It is certainly possible that some of the people who used to live in the area surrounding Jerusalem thousands of years ago were Jews who converted to christianity and then Islam. That is certainly not implausible. The refugee camps were not created by Jews pushing local inhabitants out of the way however. When Enland separated it’s middle east territory, which they called Palestine, into Trans-Jordan and Israel they told everyone in the area they could go to one or the other. Jews to one side Muslims to the other. They did this with India and Pakistan as well, Hindus to one side, Muslims to the other, so that they could decolonialize the area. Every one knew the deal and those who stayed were completely aware that in staying they were going to automatically become citizens of the new Jewish state & be beholden to the laws of the new state. Many left to relocate in Jordan. Some stayed. Lots of Arab Jews migrated in as well from less than friendly Arab countries. It was a good plan. It seemed to work with India & pakistan. However, the Arab countries were pretty angry at being under English rule and were even more pissed when the United Nations voted to help England make Trans-Jordan & Israel legitimate countries. The Arab nations refused to acknowledge the legitimacy of the United Nations conference of legitimacy on Israel. They wanted Germany or part of Africa to become the new Jewish state. So, on the day of declaration, the first day as a nation for Israel, the Arab nations on all sides attacked unanimously. They told the Arab Muslim inhabitants to get out of the way so they could kill all the Jews. Most ran, some stayed to fight the attackers off and some stayed to try to kill Jews there. This phenomenon is called a 5th column. Israel won and made large gains in territory in the process. Israel gave back the majority of the territory in return for peace treaties. What about those who fled? They were technically Israeli citizens & the Arab counrties did not want them, even though they invited them in to flee. So the Arab nations penned them up in ghettos & called them refugees & told Israel they were their problem. There were also Arab Muslims who stayed in Israel to kill Jews. They were pissed. So they congregated in their own neighborhoods and started lobbying and then fighting for their own territory. This would be an act of civil disobedience turned to civil war really. Israel couldn’t stop them from killing other citizens, dispite all kinds of offers for peace deals that included the 95% of what they wanted, so they just left the areas to give them the independence to rule themselves. The Israelis retained agreements to control the borders along with Egypt to keep them out of Israel & Egypt and to keep weapons from getting in. Now the border walls are the question. Checkpoints had to be established because part of Palestinean “freedom” terror tactic was to send suicide bombers into public areas of Israel and kill as many as possible. At this point one would think that once Israel pulled out the suicide bombers would stop and the Palestineans would celebrate their victory. On the contrary. Israel had to put up a wall to stop people from sneaking in to set off more bombs. They also had to go kill opertives bombing the border from inside the Palestinean Territory. The election of Hamas increased these bombings. Why? Becaue when you ask a Palestinean why they will tell ou that all of Israel is theirs. They believe that Israel was stolen from them and that the Jews are illegal immigrants. Why, because the history books in their schools and the political leaders there tell them so. Their territory recieves more UN aid per person than any other group in the world. Where does all that money go? Do the Palestinean people even know that the world is giving so much money? When Israel left they left hospitals and greenhouses and schools. The palestineans blew them all up on purpose. Israel has supplied them with their utilities since they left since the Palestineans refused to build their own. Why? Because they are energized by anger and indoctrinated with hate. We will get peace when the UN takes over and keeps them from spending all their welfare money on bombs.

  157. 157alex the great on Jan 4, 2009 at 1:42 pm:

    I don’t really care for Jews and the same can be said about Arabs and Muslims and Christians. As a more nutral party. I can say with conviction that ham-ass was elected by the people of Gaza and so are equal to it in that they support them. So the natural conclusion that can be understod is they have brought the current situation on themselves. Perhaps if they dislike being bombed in the future they will vote more carefully next time. If they truely want to end this conflict then the people must stop Ham-ass from shooting rockets at the Jews. If their interest was piece then they should have used their vote to put in power someone who was interested in piece and not Ham-ass.

  158. 158Gerry on Jan 4, 2009 at 2:18 pm:

    Oh, puhleeze, Zombie. You are often linked by and Posts advocating the death of every man, woman, and child in Gaza appear often, and are never deleted. In fact, they are cheered, and any posts criticizing these calls for genocide are immediately denounced by the regulars.

  159. 159Sick Of It on Jan 4, 2009 at 2:28 pm:

    All those Jew haters, think about this, if Israel hated the Palestinians, then why is Israel just invading Gaza? Why not include the West Bank? Maybe it is because missle attacks don’t originate from the West Bank. Only from the Gaza strip where Palestinian moderates are held to maintain forced tolerance for the Hamas. A most recent report is that Fatah loyalists are being shot in the legs for allegedly expressing joy over the IDF air strikes on Hamas targets and as a result of Abbas’s announcement to the Fatah party loyalist to prepare themselves to reassume authority in the Gaza strip as a result of the possible toppling of Hamas,,

  160. 160Hard Right on Jan 4, 2009 at 2:35 pm:

    Rob Spectre, considering your support of hamas, I find your claims to be pure bullsh*t. You aren’t fooling anyone here. We now what kind of “person” you are.

  161. 161Hard Right on Jan 4, 2009 at 2:44 pm:

    For all you leftists supporting hamas, you only prove that liberalism IS a mental illness.

  162. 162Carpet Burn on Jan 4, 2009 at 2:47 pm:

    Palestine deserves to be free.

    Free to be gay, that is. C’mon you anti-Semites, I know you are just unhappy being who you are. You just blame Israel because of your sexual dissatisfaction..

    Hot Pally wad is what it’s all about. Get rid of those burka hoes fellas. There’s a reason Muslims bend over 5 times a day and it ain’t because they are looking for change.

  163. 163Gypsedrifter on Jan 4, 2009 at 2:57 pm:

    To Barbara

    You are so right! And I am afraid it will come to that here in America. Please support Israel and our Constitution. All real Americans

  164. 164Jon on Jan 4, 2009 at 3:10 pm:

    I support Israel 100%. These arab/muslim scum have contributed nothing to society except death and violence and oppression. I used to live in San Fran but left the entire state because of the nutjobs running the asylum there. The only good palestinian/arab is a dead one.

  165. 165Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 3:25 pm:

    Israel should stop worrying about public opinion, declare total war on Hamas, and drive the entire gazan population into Egypt, or bury them.

    That’s how the US used to roll, until politically correct bullshit turned our foreign policy into a joke. Imagine for just a moment how China would deal with a combative neighbor firing rockets into their territory. They’d hit the place with a human wave of millions of pissed off soldiers. Yeah it’s collective punishment, and so what? Google the career of American General Curtis LeMay to see some real collective punishment.

  166. 166Crusty on Jan 4, 2009 at 3:29 pm:

    Grand hypocrisy. Palestinians and their ilk cry “death to Jews”, “slaughter the Jews”, but denounce Israel for wanting “genocide.” Is it their Islamic blinders that make them view killing Jews and Christian (or “apes and pigs” in their parlance) a holy task but retaliation against thousands of rocket and missile attacks “genodice”? These people are dead from the neck up.

  167. 167Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 3:46 pm:

    I think I should infilrate those protests with a sign saying “Kill all Infidels” on one side, and “Death to America” on the other side. Then while wearing a headscarf to hide my identity, I could try to provoke a riot, with the fervent hope that it causes the SFPD to apply their beatsticks to the skulls of those terror-lovin assholes.

  168. 168American on Jan 4, 2009 at 4:07 pm:




    The Independent & The Independent on Sunday

    Our reign of terror, by the Israeli army

    In shocking testimonies that reveal abductions, beatings and torture, Israeli soldiers confess the horror they have visited on Hebron

    By Donald Macintyre in Jerusalem

    Saturday, 19 April 2008


    Israeli soldiers detain a Palestinian student during a protest in Hebron in 2005. Hebron is the only Palestinian city whose centre is directly controlled by the Israeli military

    The dark-haired 22-year-old in black T-shirt, blue jeans and red Crocs is understandably hesitant as he sits at a picnic table in the incongruous setting of a beauty spot somewhere in Israel. We know his name and if we used it he would face a criminal investigation and a probable prison sentence.

    The birds are singing as he describes in detail some of what he did and saw others do as an enlisted soldier in Hebron. And they are certainly criminal: the incidents in which Palestinian vehicles are stopped for no good reason, the windows smashed and the occupants beaten up for talking back – for saying, for example, they are on the way to hospital; the theft of tobacco from a Palestinian shopkeeper who is then beaten “to a pulp” when he complains; the throwing of stun grenades through the windows of mosques as people prayed. And worse.

    The young man left the army only at the end of last year, and his decision to speak is part of a concerted effort to expose the moral price paid by young Israeli conscripts in what is probably the most problematic posting there is in the occupied territories. Not least because Hebron is the only Palestinian city whose centre is directly controlled by the military, 24/7, to protect the notably hardline Jewish settlers there. He says firmly that he now regrets what repeatedly took place during his tour of duty.

    But his frequent, if nervous, grins and giggles occasionally show just a hint of the bravado he might have displayed if boasting of his exploits to his mates in a bar. Repeatedly he turns to the older former soldier who has persuaded him to speak to us, and says as if seeking reassurance: “You know how it is in Hebron.”

    The older ex-soldier is Yehuda Shaul, who does indeed “know how it is in Hebron”, having served in the city in a combat unit at the peak of the intifada, and is a founder of Shovrim Shtika, or Breaking the Silence, which will publish tomorrow the disturbing testimonies of 39 Israelis – including this young man – who served in the army in Hebron between 2005 and 2007. They cover a range of experiences, from anger and powerlessness in the face of often violent abuse of Arabs by hardline Jewish settlers, through petty harassment by soldiers, to soldiers beating up Palestinian residents without provocation, looting homes and shops, and opening fire on unarmed demonstrators.

    The maltreatment of civilians under occupation is common to many armies in the world – including Britain’s, from Northern Ireland to Iraq.

    But, paradoxically, few if any countries apart from Israel have an NGO like Breaking the Silence, which seeks – through the experiences of the soldiers themselves – as its website puts it “to force Israeli society to address the reality which it created” in the occupied territories.

    The Israeli public was given an unflattering glimpse of military life in Hebron this year when a young lieutenant in the Kfir Brigade called Yaakov Gigi was given a 15-month jail sentence for taking five soldiers with him to hijack a Palestinian taxi, conduct what the Israeli media called a “rampage” in which one of the soldiers shot and wounded a Palestinian civilian who just happened to be in the wrong place, and then tried to lie his way out of it.

    In a confessional interview with the Israeli Channel Two investigative programme Uvda, Gigi, who had previously been in many ways a model soldier, talked of “losing the human condition” in Hebron. Asked what he meant, he replied: “To lose the human condition is to become an animal.”

    The Israeli military did not prosecute the soldier who had fired on the Palestinian, as opposed to Gigi. But the military insists “that the events that occurred within the Kfir Brigade are highly unusual”.

    But as the 22-year-old soldier, also in the Kfir Brigade, confirms in his testimony to Breaking the Silence, it seems that the event may not have been exceptional. Certainly, our interview tells us, he was “many times” in groups that commandeered taxis, seated the driver in the back, and told him to direct them to places “where they hate the Jews” in order to “make a balagan” – Hebrew for “big mess”.

    Then there is the inter- clan Palestinian fight: “We were told to go over there and find out what was happening. Our [platoon] commander was a bit screwed in the head. So anyway, we would locate houses, and he’d tell us: ‘OK, anyone you see armed with stones or whatever, I don’t care what – shoot.’ Everyone would think it’s the clan fight…” Did the company commander know? “No one knew. Platoon’s private initiative, these actions.”

    Did you hit them? “Sure, not just them. Anyone who came close … Particularly legs and arms. Some people also sustained abdominal hits … I think at some point they realised it was soldiers, but they were not sure. Because they could not believe soldiers would do this, you know.”

    Or using a 10-year-old child to locate and punish a 15-year-old stone-thrower: “So we got hold of just some Palestinian kid nearby, we knew that he knew who it had been. Let’s say we beat him a little, to put it mildly, until he told us. You know, the way it goes when your mind’s already screwed up, and you have no more patience for Hebron and Arabs and Jews there.

    “The kid was really scared, realising we were on to him. We had a commander with us who was a bit of a fanatic. We gave the boy over to this commander, and he really beat the shit out of him … He showed him all kinds of holes in the ground along the way, asking him: ‘Is it here you want to die? Or here?’ The kid goes, ‘No, no!’

    “Anyway, the kid was stood up, and couldn’t stay standing on his own two feet. He was already crying … And the commander continues, ‘Don’t pretend’ and kicks him some more. And then [name withheld], who always had a hard time with such things, went in, caught the squad commander and said, ‘Don’t touch him any more, that’s it.’ The commander goes, ‘You’ve become a leftie, what?’ And he answers, ‘No, I just don’t want to see such things.’

    “We were right next to this, but did nothing. We were indifferent, you know. OK. Only after the fact you start thinking. Not right away. We were doing such things every day … It had become a habit…

    “And the parents saw it. The commander ordered [the mother], ‘Don’t get any closer.’ He cocked his weapon, already had a bullet inside. She was frightened. He put his weapon literally inside the kid’s mouth. ‘Anyone gets close, I kill him. Don’t bug me. I kill. I have no mercy.’ So the father … got hold of the mother and said, ‘Calm down, let them be, so they’ll leave him alone.’”

    Not every soldier serving in Hebron becomes an “animal”. Iftach Arbel, 23, from an upper-middle class, left-of-centre home in Herzylia, served in Hebron as a commander just before the withdrawal from Gaza, when he thinks the army wanted to show it could be tough with settlers, too. And many of the testimonies, including Mr Arbel’s, describe how the settlers educate children as young as four to throw stones at Palestinians, attack their homes and even steal their possessions. To Mr Arbel, the Hebron settlers are “pure evil” and the only solution is “to remove the settlers”.

    He believes it would be possible even within these constraints to treat Palestinians better. He adds: “We did night activity. Choose a house at random, on the aerial photo, so as to practise combat routine and all, which is instructive for the soldiers, I mean, I’m all for it. But then at midnight you wake someone up and turn his whole house upside down with everyone sleeping on the mattresses and all.”

    But Mr Arbel says that most soldiers are some way between his own extreme and that of the most violent. From just two of his fellow testifiers, you can see what he means.

    As one said: “We did all kinds of experiments to see who could do the best split in Abu Snena. We would put [Palestinians] against the wall, make like we were checking them, and ask them to spread their legs. Spread, spread, spread, it was a game to see who could do it best. Or we would check who can hold his breath for longest.

    “Choke them. One guy would come, make like he was checking them, and suddenly start yelling like they said something and choke them … Block their airways; you have to press the adams apple. It’s not pleasant. Look at the watch as you’re doing it, until he passes out. The one who takes longest to faint wins.”

    And theft as well as violence. “There’s this car accessory shop there. Every time, soldiers would take a tape-disc player, other stuff. This guy, if you go ask him, will tell you plenty of things that soldiers did to him.

    “A whole scroll-full … They would raid his shop regularly. ‘Listen, if you tell on us, we’ll confiscate your whole store, we’ll break everything.’ You know, he was afraid to tell. He was already making deals, ‘Listen guys, you’re damaging me financially.’ I personally never took a thing, but I’m telling you, people used to take speakers from him, whole sound systems.

    “He’d go, ‘Please, give me 500 shekels, I’m losing money here.’ ‘Listen, if you go on – we’ll pick up your whole shop.’ ‘OK, OK, take it, but listen, don’t take more than 10 systems a month.’ Something like this.

    “‘I’m already going bankrupt.’ He was so miserable. Guys in our unit used to sell these things back home, make deals with people. People are so stupid.”

    The military said that Israeli Defence Forces soldiers operate according to “a strict set of moral guidelines” and that their expected adherence to them only “increases wherever and whenever IDF soldiers come in contact with civilians”. It added that “if evidence supporting the allegations is uncovered, steps are taken to hold those involved to the level of highest judicial severity”. It also said: “The Military Advocate General has issued a number of indictments against soldiers due to allegations of criminal behaviour … Soldiers found guilty were punished severely by the Military Court, in proportion to the committed offence.” It had not by last night quantified such indictments.

    In its introduction to the testimonies, Breaking the Silence says: “The soldiers’ determination to fulfil their mission yields tragic results: the proper-normative becomes despicable, the inconceivable becomes routine … [The] testimonies are to illustrate the manner in which they are swept into the brutal reality reigning on the ground, a reality whereby the lives of many thousands of Palestinian families are at the questionable mercy of youths. Hebron turns a focused, flagrant lens at the reality to which Israel’s young representatives are constantly sent.”

    A force for justice

    Breaking the Silence was formed four years ago by a group of ex-soldiers, most of whom had served in Israel Defence Forces combat units in Hebron. Many of the soldiers do reserve duty in the military each year. It has collected some 500 testimonies from former soldiers who served in the West Bank and Gaza. Its first public exposure was with an exhibition of photographs by soldiers serving in Hebron and the organisation also runs regular tours of Hebron for Israeli students and diplomats. It receives funding from groups as diverse as the Jewish philanthropic Moriah Fund, the New Israel Fund, the British embassy in Tel Aviv and the EU.


  169. 169Clutch on Jan 4, 2009 at 5:32 pm:

    Know Islam, no peace.

    No Islam, know peace.

  170. 170Skip Smith on Jan 4, 2009 at 5:34 pm:

    The funniest thing about this thread are all the people that post those super long messages that nobody else will bother to read.

  171. 171Jeff on Jan 4, 2009 at 5:35 pm:

    scorch the earth of Gaza … the only good Hamas member is a dead one …

  172. 172Clutch on Jan 4, 2009 at 5:40 pm:

    “Anonymous” on this thread is an IGNORE-ant tool, spouting lie after libtard talking point after terrorist apologist falsehood ad nauseum. Betcha he sticks his rancid keister up in the air five times a day for Alan & Moe-HamHead to take a poke at, too.

  173. 173Dave Surls on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:00 pm:

    #158, you’re exactly right. I used to be a fan of this site until I realized what kind of blatant hypocrites I was hanging out with.

  174. 174Yael on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:33 pm:

    I know a family of European Holocaust survivors who went from the Nazi camps to Israel and settled in Yamit in the Sinai. Israel ethnically cleansed the Sinai and delivered it Jew-free to Egypt in exchange for a cold peace in the 70s. The family moved to Gush Katif (Jewish communities in Gaza) and were forcibly expelled from there by Israel in August 2005 so that the Palestinians could have it, Jew-free, in exchange for nothing (then HAMAS won the election and took Gaza in a bloody coup). More than three years later, my friends still haven’t recovered, don’t have a permanent home or employment, and now they’re being attacked with Hamas rockets. True story. And the moral of the story is, “No Peace. Justice.” My prayers are with the Israel Defense Forces. May they be successful and come home safely.

  175. 175Eddy on Jan 4, 2009 at 6:55 pm:


    Uh, how far back do we go to determine “stolen”? The land the world over has belonged to one group of people before being conquered and conquered again throughout history. The country is Israel and its borders, like any other country in the world, have to be respected in order to have lasting peace. Your fantastical thinking is as irrational as those in Hamas.

  176. 176Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 7:12 pm:

    Well one thing to think about is that old maps of Israel show that it goes far into Iraq or even further – All the land has been stolen from them by Muslims and they are still not happy and want to take what little land the jews have. America needs to wake up! The Jewish people have been through more than any other group of people in this country or world. Black people have not endured even a 1/4 of what these people have and you don’t see them crying and yelling in the streets.

  177. 177Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 7:14 pm:

    You know whats great is Israel is kicking their ass as we speak !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


  178. 178Dave Surls on Jan 4, 2009 at 7:51 pm:

    You mean like Israel “kicked ass” in Lebanon? Here’s hoping …

  179. 179Lynn B. on Jan 4, 2009 at 8:06 pm:

    OMG Zombie … have you been invaded by Stormfront? These comments contain some of the most illiterate and vile antisemitic filth I’ve ever read on the internet. Some of it, though, is so idiotic as to be almost amusing.

    Take Lisa (#97)/Leeza (#101) (obviously the same person) as an example. It pretends to have been married to a Jewish man but obviously hasn’t bothered to do its homework.

    “The Temple Synagogue in Florida were prejustice and they expressed only views that Jews are the best thing on earth. When I was at that Temple, I felt like I was in a cult and they constantly wanted me to convert. When I finally advised I did not totally follow their rules of Torah and views of the mesiah Elohim and jesus christ, the Rabbi pulled me from teaching school there and eventually insulted me for not thinking like them.

    … Vist their site here:”

    “She” then proceeds to link to the website of a very nice legal librarian in Chester County, Pennsylvania (I’ve met her at our local synagogue, which is half a mile from my house and I assure you I’m a very long way from Florida).

    Lisa/Leeza has an extremely poor command of the English language and apparently doesn’t know that Jews have no “mesiah Elohim.” Poor thing.

    This war is certainly bringing them out of the woodwork.

  180. 180Dave Surls on Jan 4, 2009 at 8:38 pm:

    Speaking of woodwork, I’m working over my wood right now. War makes me horny.

  181. 181Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 9:09 pm:

    actually what caused the anger was when a isreali women tried to attack a protester, this particular video did not show this but other videos on youtube do.

  182. 182Anonymous on Jan 4, 2009 at 9:22 pm:

    Historically Jews have not conquered and attacked other countries ruthlessly or converted non Jews to Jews. Islam has spread with violence and terror and its followers convert non Muslims to Islam at the point of a swordd . Islam is a political cause and its objective is to convert the whole world to Islam . They are Champion of ‘Ethnic cleansing. Witness the plight of non muslims in Islamic countries and compare to how muslims live in democratic west. You give an inch to a muslim be prepared to lose the country. Its happened again and again. Muslims immigrate to western democratic countries , live freely, yet their loyalty is always to the’nation of Islam’. They use democracy to further the cause of Islam. You can not reason with people who have used violence as a means to achieve their objective of world dominance since the birth of Islam. American liberals have no clue about history and they are in total denial about the violent nature of Islam. Very few of the muslims living in democratic countries will ever ‘fight’ for the country they live in, they have only one cause ‘promote Islam and destroy non muslims.

  183. 183Ken on Jan 4, 2009 at 10:09 pm:

    What a pity. This ridiculous conflict continues with each generation that passes, with no end in sight.

    Tiaojin (present-day Chinese Jews related to the original Chinese Jews from Kaifeng in Henan) live alongside the Uyghur and Hui (Chinese Muslims) out here in China with no problem at all. The rest of the world needs to take note of why this is.

  184. 184Skip Smith on Jan 4, 2009 at 11:54 pm:

    The rest of the world needs to take note of why this is.


    Because if they don’t they get exterminated?

  185. 185Ken on Jan 5, 2009 at 12:12 am:

    “Because if they don’t they get exterminated?”

    A laughably stupid and predictable response, and an inaccurate one.

    Although, hey, if the threat of such gets the job done then why not?

  186. 186Allah on Jan 5, 2009 at 12:29 am:

    Wherever the muslim stood, there is a violence and smokes. What they believe is totally foolish and not contributing to the harmonious of the world’s mankind. They are taught to be selfish and they are selfish!! They do not know how to respect other religion. They only know piggy and doggy Allah.

    Long live ISRAEL!!!! Wipe off the Muslim from Earth……

    Muslim love to pray as the way doggy and piggy four legged stand. BE CONSIDERATE TO OTHER RELIGION other than muslim!!!

  187. 187Skip Smith on Jan 5, 2009 at 12:39 am:

    A laughably stupid and predictable response, and an inaccurate one.


    Right, sorry. It’s not like the Chinese have a history of oppressing minority groups or anything. What was I thinking?

  188. 188Creamy Doughnut on Jan 5, 2009 at 12:41 am:

    It’s the Juice fault.

    Mostly cranberry but sometimes grape.

    I meant Jooos, sorry!

    We Hamas are superior. We can have sex with a goat ten times a day and not even get tired. No Israeli weakling can compete with such strength, I don’t even see them do it to goat one time! HA HA HA! We Hamas are much better!

  189. 189Felix335 on Jan 5, 2009 at 3:07 am:

    I live in Reno and enjoy watching the Bay Area much as a zoo patron enjoys watching the animals. Where to start? in 1948 Arabs in the soon-to-become Israel were given a choice: stay here and be neutral, stay here and fight with us (many did), or leave. Most left fearing the up coming Arab invasion of the U.N. recognized Israel. Many of them just feared the violence and it is hard to blame them. But most Arabs fled with assurances that they could return after the elimination of Israel and share in the spoils. You makes yer choice, ya takes your chances. Israel defeated the illegal and immoral Arab invasion and fought off several subsequent invasions and decades of massive terrorism. Did the major (or minor for that fact) countries offer up a new land for “Palestine”???? No. Although Israel is far from perfect and has, from time to time, overreacted to Arab terrorism and threats, the fact remains that Israel has gone to bat for peace and a dedicated homeland for “Palestine” time after time. For many radical Arabs, terrorist organizations such as Hamas, Hezbollah, Islamic Jihad, an Al Queda are their mechanism for another Holocaust. Israel, as any other soverign nation, has a U.N. and international law right of self defense (rockets and mortars from Gaza, anyone?) both military and economic. Gazans had/have choices: choose Hamas a unalterable foe of Israel or Fatah. They chose Hamas and never ending conflict. Civilians in Gaza and elsewhere have a duty to reject governments who wish to export violence.

    The useful idiots of Answer and other local leftists who immediately condemn Israel but are strangely silent on the 3,000 rockets and mortars fired from Gaza into Israel in 2008 and suicide bombers, and other violent Arab extremist acts, would do well to remember that they are associating themselves with ideas and groups that would seek to emulate the Holocaust and the 6 million dead Jews of Europe. Pity the day that the leftists in our Democratic party decide to abandon Israel much as they abandonded South Vietnam, Cambodia, and Laos to the tender mercies of the Vietnamese communists.

  190. 190Ken on Jan 5, 2009 at 4:54 am:

    “What was I thinking?”

    It’s not your fault, you’re just naive. No doubt you’ve spent little to no time in China at all and only have a vague awareness of the issues from the spin the Western media puts on them. I’ve traveled extensively through Tibet and Xinjiang and found no evidence of widespread minority opression. The so-called “endangered” Tibetan language is spoken fluently by 95% of Tibetan people and a language isn’t considered endangered until it is spoken by less than 20% of the youngest generation of that particular ethnic group. That’s merely one example.

    Check out Barry Sautman’s work for more eye-openers about the supposed oppression of national minorities in China (Tibet specifically).

    Not that that has anything to do with this thread’s topic, however. But if Jews and Muslims live together in peace in China, why can’t they in the Middle East?

  191. 191Lamen on Jan 5, 2009 at 9:21 am:

    My favorite part is after the outnumbered pro-israel protestors are assualted, and shuffled off by police. A Female Palestinian protest-organizor is screaming at police to “stop them! Just F–king stop them!” As if the tiny group, silently holding Israeli flags, were the real problem here.

  192. 192Anonymous on Jan 5, 2009 at 10:52 am:

    Please stop advocating hate.

  193. 193Anonymous on Jan 5, 2009 at 10:55 am:

    Why has Israel stopped any neutral news sources from entering Gaza?

  194. 194bystander on Jan 5, 2009 at 10:58 am:

    it doesnt take more than 30 seconds to see which side represents the >1 billion savage animals brainwashed by a violent ideology over-breeding to take over the world and which side represents the fewer than 14 million civilized human beings.

  195. 195Skip Smith on Jan 5, 2009 at 11:05 am:

    It’s not your fault, you’re just naive.


    Kenn I guess it’s not your fault either. You’re just saying what you need to say to avoid being deported.

  196. 196Skip Smith on Jan 5, 2009 at 11:14 am:

    I’ve traveled extensively through Tibet and Xinjiang and found no evidence of widespread minority opression.


    Maybe that’s because they don’t let you travel there when they’re doing the oppressing. Foreigners were banned from traveling to Tibet during the pre-Olympic riots, remember? Why would the Chinese do that if there’s nothing to hide?


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